Thread: Knives, rights, etc.

Originally Posted by Spike J

My solution FWIW is the reintroduction of corporal punishment in schools & homes. A parent can be charged with assault for smacking their child, I kid you not. If A decent standard of discipline was established, those who could or would not obey the rules of a civilised society would learn the hard & painful consequences of their misbehaviour. A cane across the back of the knuckles reminds you not to do it far longer than a telling off.

It used to be like that over here in the 'good' old days.
Of course those positions of power (in schools and in churches) seemed to be filled in most often by power hungry bastards who were all too fond of doling out corporal punishment to make their point.
Nothing attracts sadist scumbags like absolute power.

My parents were able to bring me up without needing to smack, cane or whip me.
It's not the smacking that makes the kids, it's the parenting. And that's where it often goes wrong.
There are plenty ways to discipline kids without needing violence.

Then, Bruno, you end up in the situation where children can not disciplined at all & have to be bribed with pop &sweeties to shut up in front of the TV. They are unholy terrors when not sedated thus. A group of them stand across the street from our flat & throw bricks & stones at passing buses & cars. By the time the police arrive they ahve run off. Their parents are terrified of them too & refuse to chastise them in any way. Some parents even encourage them. The parenting skills are just not there to enable the children to grow up into reasonable people.
I am not suggesting that all children should be smacked but that the option should be there if needed. Not all who reproduce are natural parents.

Originally Posted by Spike J

BBC NEWS | Politics | Shock tactics for knife carriers

You see gents, knives in this country are our latest social evil. Social evil is good description of what our government is doing.

There have been a number of stabbings in this country & the media is whipping it up into the political hot potato ahead of the summer lull. The more I see, the more I want to head for the hills.

Let the media do the work of whipping th populace up for you guys. Then hold rallies demanding the right to be armed with guns to deter the knife wielding thugs. Seems like a logical solution to me.


The nicest thing over here is that most states now have laws keeping us from being victims in our own homes. Over here most place if someone breaks into your house you can assume they are there to kill you and take extreme measures to prevent that from happening without having to worry about trying to escape or any repercussions. Our houses are once again safe as......(you know)

Originally Posted by Spike J

Not all who reproduce are natural parents.

Amen on that. If I see how some of my friends raise their children, I cannot help but think 'WTF are you thinking' are you actively trying to make them spoiled brats and bullies?

Fwiw my oldest has received a slap on her butt a couple of times when it was warranted. But that is only in exceptional circumstances (like when she hurt her younger sister on purpose).

The usual punishment is standing in a corner with her face to the wall.
You might say 'but what if he / she just walks away'
The key thing is to persevere when you first begin doing this. The first times when we used this technique, it took more than 15 minutes before she finally gave in and stayed put. But it's a matter of perseverance. Now she stays put because she knows that we don't give in, and that it'll only last longer if she tries.

Mature elephants are chained to a post by a finger thick chain. It could easily rip both the chain and the post to pieces. But this form of restraint starts when they are calves, and initially they fight theirselves into exhaustion to get free. But in the end their will is broken and they know they can't win.
And even so many years later when they can rip trees out of the ground with their trunks, they still don't fight against the chain because they have learned that no matter what they try, it won't work.

This same principle holds true when disciplining kids. Once they accept that they will not win, they won't fight against the punishment.
The problem is that a lot of parents just don't want to make the effort, and give in.

Originally Posted by Bruno

But in the end their will is broken and they know they can't win...
This same principle holds true when disciplining kids.

maybe it's just me, but that sounds sort of ominous. if I ever have the misfortune of children, I'll raise 'em just like my parents raised me. that sat me down and told me that they didn't care in the slightest if I obeyed them or not. it was my choice. but if I wanted to buy disobedience, the price was steep and the payment would be pain. after a few choice indiscretions, I found that the juice just wasn't worth the squeeze, and that the fun of disobedience was just not equal to the pain of a solid whoopin'

*shrugs* to each their own. I'd rather teach a child free will, and the responsible acceptance of consequences, than break their will to make them easier to discipline. but maybe I just read too much into it

Huh. We were spanked until we were old enough to talk and hold/understand a conversation. Then it was even worse than the spankings. If I made bad decisions I was often made to access them and determine my own punishment (knowing that a veto was just around the corner if I should come in inequitably). Most times, I just wished they'd hit me and get it over with! I believe in this way though I learned better reasoning under pressure and how to make difficult decisions under stress. I also learned to respect my parents and felt that they respected me as I was able to have discussions on things I felt were unfair in our household. It was sort of a benevolent dictatorship.

Okay, sorry for the continued thread Hijacking...knives and rights people, knives and rights....lol

Originally Posted by jockeys

*shrugs* to each their own. I'd rather teach a child free will, and the responsible acceptance of consequences, than break their will to make them easier to discipline. but maybe I just read too much into it

I don't have all the answers either. This approach seems to work.

I just wanted to add that I am not taking away their free will either. They still can (and do) make the choice between obeying or not, and face the consequences. Only in my case they learn to accept the consequences because they know they can't escape those.

This would be the same as smacking them, except they are not afraid of me.
If you need to smack a kid repeatedly to make it obey, it's will is broken just as much as by the non-violent approach. Either one is a way to obedience.

Originally Posted by nun2sharp

BTW: wasnt it a few years back some englishman found intruders in his house and shot them as he should, and then the govt gave the surviving criminal the money to sue the homeowner.

That would be Tony Martin a Farm owner, who shot 2 chavs who broke into his house. The only reason he got done for it was because he shot one of the scrotes in the back as he was running away! It cause a huge outrage at the time and still does now on occasion.

Originally Posted by JMS

You are welcome to come here, as we need more men who think like you do in this country! Don't forget to bring your mead!!

I hope I'm included in that offer!! I'll bring my blades too.

Originally Posted by Wildtim

Let the media do the work of whipping th populace up for you guys. Then hold rallies demanding the right to be armed with guns to deter the knife wielding thugs. Seems like a logical solution to me.

The nicest thing over here is that most states now have laws keeping us from being victims in our own homes. Over here most place if someone breaks into your house you can assume they are there to kill you and take extreme measures to prevent that from happening without having to worry about trying to escape or any repercussions. Our houses are once again safe as......(you know)

I like that idea Tim, I'd be more than willing to stand as a modern day Boudica to overthrow the Government media whores......................

Originally Posted by Bruno

If I see how some of my friends raise their children, I cannot help but think 'WTF are you thinking' are you actively trying to make them spoiled brats and bullies?

The usual punishment is standing in a corner with her face to the wall.
You might say 'but what if he / she just walks away'
The key thing is to persevere when you first begin doing this. The first times when we used this technique, it took more than 15 minutes before she finally gave in and stayed put. But it's a matter of perseverance. Now she stays put because she knows that we don't give in, and that it'll only last longer if she tries.

I have seen this sooooo many times with my friends kids. One brat in question used to rule the roost at the age of 5. His parents pandered to him way too much, gave in to him and it got to the point he was physically lashing out. Dad wanted to dicipline, Mom didn't and they would row about the situation.

I was asked to babysit on one occasion (when he was 8) and it wasn't going too well, when the brat swore at me then punched his sister!!!!! I marched him upstairs holding his wrist way above his head as he was still trying to hit me and dumped him in his bedroom where I told him to stay and calm down and think about what he was doing.

As I shut the room door he threw himself at the other side and was howling like a banshee just because he couldn't get one over on me. Needless to say when I babysat after that he knew the score, be good and it's loads of fun..............misbehave or be rude to me and may the God's help you!

Spikes 5 year old now knows that when it's bedtime that means go to sleep, no messing around or playing with your toys after lights out. I told her big trouble if you don't go to sleep now and she askes "what sort of trouble?"! I had to laugh, even if it was in my head. Big trouble = No Dr Who, no TV, no playtime in the bath, no taking the dogs for a walk. You will sit at the table all day and not move only to go to the bathroom. Want more??? Thankfully we've never had to enforce it.

My parents only smacked me a few times when I was small, mostly it was being sent to sit on the stairs, no toys. As I got older it was no TV/Atari and then finally being grounded, which included no phone calls either! At times I hated my parents because of how strict they were but you appreciate it when you get older and realise it was for your own good.

when we have to give up the right to keep and bear armes is the day when we have the right not to pay any more taxes. that should shut up all of them.

i am 24 annd there has not been a single day in my life since the age of 9 that i have not had a knife in my pocket. its perfectly normal. and alot better than everyone walking around with guns tucked into their pants where ever they go. now that just makes no sense at all to me