Thread: The war in Georgia

Originally Posted by marosell

Russia never said anything when we invaded Iraq and overthrew the government. Does it matter what Russia might want to do to Georgia, especially since they showed signs of first-aggression?

Simply put: It's none of our f'n business.

Actually, they had plenty to say about it, but they didn't do anything about it. We're doing the same thing here (I hope) - as we should.

Jordan

You know I hear kids in the street being told of because they fight with one another and the come-back they always have with their parents is 'he/she started it!' Its not about who started it. Its about who stopped it. America has it right this time. Condemn the violence verbally. Russia has it wrong. They should not have taken it upon themselves to wade in. But hey, what do I know?

At this time Russia stopped the war. Russia defends South Ossetia, if not - it would be the second Yugoslavia.

Originally Posted by sidneykidney

Small country has problems within itself and tries to deal with it by force, dictatorstyle. Larger countries wade in telling them what they are doing is wrong and that they should not use force to dictate and opress. The larger countries use bombs to express themselves. The larger countries are condemned by other nations.

What's that saying about the definition of insanity? Something about doing the same thing repeatedly but expecting a different result each time?

Russia said there would be pay back for Kosovo, and here it is. We have focused on Iraq for awhile, the Russians have aspirations of repairing their empire. They have been undermining the Georgian government since the beginning. The Georgians have gotten themselves too close to the US, and now are sorry for it. I'm glad we are sending humanitarian aid, it is a shame we used their 2,000 soldiers in an attempt to justify the "coalition". I worked with Georgian snipers in Iraq. I didn't much care for them, but that's another matter. the Aussies were really cool, but they have a hard time getting promotions. they used to throw some wicked parties in Baghdad.

Sometimes you have to wonder just what will happen next. Kind of looks like we may get a cold war going again. Can you hear those defense contractors salivating in unison? Yee-HAAAA; we got the cold war back! Start passing all those new taxes! Russia is considering arming its Baltic fleet with nuclear warheads for the first time since the cold war. The new Russian threat comes in response to the conflict in the Caucasus and a deal signed between the United States and Poland for a missile defense shield in Europe. Of course the Russian President Medvedev see's this as a direct threat to his country, smart guy, eh? Then there is Israel, still wanting to attack Iran. This would be foolish to say the least. Think Russia...
Reading further into world wide headlines, I see Ms. Rice was expected to visit Israel and the Palestinian Authority, but that is off now until whenever. I'm thinking there's more to this than what the media has to say about it. The US has been trying to settle the Israeli's down a bit. But, without the visit we might not get to know Israels full intentions on dealing with Iran. Hmmm, so the Bush administration can pretend to be shocked when Israel bombs Iran?
I think this is going to happen, and the US should get out of the middle east all together. Let the countries of the middle east settle their own problems. I think they would if we would leave them be.

Originally Posted by denmason

the US should get out of the middle east all together. Let the countries of the middle east settle their own problems. I think they would if we would leave them be.

Dude! It is what we Brits were saying for years before Tony decided to make us Dubya's butt monkey! What is really galling for us is that we used to have a global reputation based on fairness, not the current incumbent of the Oval Office. Bloody colonials

Just to ensure I am not completely off topic. It still seems to me that the Russians want to keep their troops in not only Ossetia, but also Georgia itself. This does not sound like a ceasefire, more like occupation to me. Georgia is a democratic free nation, as far as that is possible. Russia may be a theoretical democracy. Theoretical to my mind given the succession that was their last election. It seems that President Medvedev believes he can act with as much impunity as, oh, say Brezhnev... Is keeping your troops within 25 miles of Tblisi withdrawing? I am just asking you understand

Why did you decide that there is democracy in Georgia? In Georgia, closed all free newspapers and TV channels, president drove all the opposition leave the country or jailed. The President of Georgia wants to NATO only for the money, he does not know how to govern, and if America does not help with money, there will be revolution and just kill him.

Originally Posted by manah

But you forget, that Georgia began the war.

I thought it was the other way around. South Ossetian separatist shelled the Georgian towns of Avnevi, Eredvi, Nuli and some others, so Georgia went into South Ossetia to stop the shelling.

Originally Posted by Dean

I thought it was the other way around. South Ossetian separatist shelled the Georgian towns of Avnevi, Eredvi, Nuli and some others, so Georgia went into South Ossetia to stop the shelling.

Absolutely. There have been some reports that Georgians were told by US not to fall for the provocations coming from Ossetia. It is a bit of a mess, but most of the people in these regions do not feel they are Georgians and they would rather be part of Russia than part of Georgia. Not the only place in the world in the same situation either. As we all see these issues never get solved consistently based on principles, but it's always about who has the power.

We won't know for decades who did what. But for now it's interesting to me how it'll all end up. Looks like Russia is determined to assert their dominance and I doubt that NATO or UN will get in military conflict with the russians. I guess at this point it's about the claim who's the biggest dog on the block. US talks a lot, but I'm not sure they are willing to escalate the confrontation with Russia much further.
I suspect that the russians will parade through Georgia for a bit longer eventually letting them have their democracy and keeping the two regions South Ossetia and Abhasia. They probably will remain 'occupied teritories' for quite some time, just like the palestinian and lebanese teritories.

I wonder if the Georgians will punish their government for this whole thing, or they wll rally around them. Despite the comments that Georgia is still welcomed to NATO, I very much doubt that this will happen anytime soon - the russians will probably take their tanks through Tbilisi if such scenario becomes somewhat reallistic, which I don't think it is. After all NATO doesn't need to escalate any unnecessary confrontation with Russia.

Ah well....