Thread: Dark Matter

Originally Posted by NYCshaver

Sure it does. If you have the means you can make the same observations.
They came up with the idea of dark matter from observations of the universe.

Prayer has nothing like that. In fact I remember a study that showed praying for sick people did nothing.

I could probably dig up the medical reports listing the fertility test results that said my wife and I were infertile. You, me, and anyone else interested can also make an observation of my two children. They exist.

So does the gravitational lensing around the Pinto star cluster. Yes, I can observe it, so can you. But what caused the gravitational lensing? Based on the current understanding of gravity based on the calculated mass of the stars in that cluster, it should not exhibit that strong a lensing effect. So, either there exists dark matter, or perhaps the gravity calculations themselves are in error at that scale? At the quantum level, inside atoms and such there is a completely different set of rules of attraction, repulsion, etc than exists at a larger scale, right?

To further my proposition that the calculations themselves may be in error:

Stuff

Now, you might be wondering how dark energy can be unknown and yet account for almost three fourths of everything. The answer lies in the very complicated math behind the basic models of cosmology. Until astronomer Edwin Hubble found that the universe was actually in motion and expanding rather than the static place scientists thought it was, there was no need to consider anything as exotic as an invisible force that pushes galaxies apart. But it was possible in Einstein’s general relativity equations which could account for an expanding or contracting universe. To make sure that all of the cosmological models in these equations stayed static, Einstein added a Λ (lambda) variable in his formulas which gave energy to theoretical empty space, the so-called cosmological constant

In the first instance, they had to re-think what they had previously been observing.

In Einstien's case, he simply added a fudge factor (he really was a genius!)

You will also see that these same theorists claim that not the world, but the universe itself is flat!

Originally Posted by Seraphim

I could probably dig up the medical reports listing the fertility test results that said my wife and I were infertile. You, me, and anyone else interested can also make an observation of my two children. They exist.

That's not repeatable evidence though. Anyone can look at the evidence for dark matter and the math. They can reproduce the same results.

Not so for prayer. When you start looking at the results of prayer they line up with random chance.

Originally Posted by Seraphim

So does the gravitational lensing around the Pinto star cluster. Yes, I can observe it, so can you. But what caused the gravitational lensing?

Dark Matter is the answer you'll get from science now. If they find evidence it's something else then they'll update their theory.

Originally Posted by Seraphim

To further my proposition that the calculations themselves may be in error:

I don't see how any of that showed that the calculations may be in error.

In fact I'm not even sure why you're trying so hard to show that the idea
of dark matter is wrong.

Originally Posted by NYCshaver

I don't see how any of that showed that the calculations may be in error.

In fact I'm not even sure why you're trying so hard to show that the idea
of dark matter is wrong.

I believe Han Solo has the answer:

Kid, I've flown from one side of this galaxy to the other. I've seen a lot of strange stuff, but I've never seen anything to make me believe there's one all-powerful Force controlling everything. There's no mystical energy field controls my destiny! It's all a lot of simple tricks and nonsense.

Originally Posted by Seraphim

I believe Han Solo has the answer:

Wouldn't that answer equally well for the existence of God?

Originally Posted by MichaelP

Wouldn't that answer equally well for the existence of God?

Which is essentially my point made in the OP:

So, scientifically speaking, dark matter is about as observable as the presence of God?

Originally Posted by Seraphim

I believe Han Solo has the answer:

That still doesn't answer why you're so interested in showing that the idea of dark matter is wrong.

Originally Posted by NYCshaver

That still doesn't answer why you're so interested in showing that the idea of dark matter is wrong.

I'm not necessarily saying it's "wrong" I'm saying it is only circumstantially observable at best.

Originally Posted by Seraphim

I'm not necessarily saying it's "wrong" I'm saying it is only circumstantially observable at best.

Well that's in the definition of dark matter:

Dark matter is a theoretical form of matter that is undetectable by its emitted radiation, but whose presence can be inferred from gravitational effects on visible matter.