Thread: Salm Rock/Old Rock Coti's vs Other vintage Coticules

Originally Posted by kcb5150

I don't really know why anyone who does carpentry or culinary work would go for anything other than synth solutions these days. DMTs, shapton glass stones, spyderco, etc.. I would, anyway. I use a shapton 500 for initial work on bevels because it is fast, almost impossible to clog, and leaves a nice, easy scratch pattern to work with.

I came to this (shaving) after several years of hand tool woodworking and still do a lot of hand tool woodworking...a lot.

I started on synthetics and pretty much use just oilstones now, but from time to time will use a sythetic medium stone followed by a large irregular piece of okudo suita.

A dry grinder does 95% of the metal removal on a woodworking tool, so the fact that the oilstones cut slower per stroke doesn't necessarily mean total sharpening time will be less.

I budget myself a minute to resharpen a chisel and a minute to grind (which occurs about once every 4 resharpenings). I like the edge that comes off of synthetics, but they don't have the same longevity, imperviousness to damage, ability to stay flat indefinitely without any conditioning, etc.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Aa0pBnph9q8

(I am not advocating that anyone watch that whole long video about sharpening a chisel, I just had to post it as a request to someone who didn't believe that you could get a working edge off of a washita stone and they wanted to know what I do - sort of akin to what was said above about sharpening certain ways with certain stones, a settled in oilstone can't operate very well just rubbing a bevel over it over and over like you can do with a very aggressive synthetic stone - the method is a bit different)

I do the bulk of my sharpening, chisels and planes, with a singe washita iron, though - similar to above. What brings a plane or chisel back to the stones is different than a razor (chisels get chipped generally and planes lose cutting clearance from abrasive/adhesive wear on wood).

there are a lot of woodworking videos out there for new woodworkers that don't advocate much skill, use of jigs, etc, and that's OK to start, but it's not very functional for a woodworker to have to get out a bunch of machinery to sharpen something and then spend 7 or 8 minutes doing it.

That's really cool. I've used chisels to break in a trans ark after lapping, but I haven't done much with washitas. I had a NO. 1 norton awhile back and some other examples. The cutting power on them calms down quite a bit with use if you don't refresh the surface. The no 1 actually cut rather fine

I don't hone a wide variety of sharp implements - just razors and knives. Being a hobbyist, I like tinkering with natural stones. I've had the Spyderco hones, but that was when I was just starting out and I think I blamed the hones for my inadequacies as a honer - so I got rid of them at the time. I still have a lot of lapping film around, and I use that occasionally and marvel at the edge it puts on, and the ease with which it cuts. When people ask me to suggest starter hones, I usually suggest lapping film, as the monetary outlay is minimal and they're easy to learn to use.

For my knives, I have never used any of my oilstones (I have a variety of Charnley, LI, etc.). Maybe it's time to branch out and use some of the oilstones on knives. I generally just use a 'vintage' combination hone I picked up in an antique store and then finish on a large bit of Asagi that I have. It works wonders.

Basically, honing is fun - and should stay that way for hobbyists. If you're not having fun with a hone, or if you lose patience with it, then stop and use something else. Everyone needs to figure out what works for themselves.

I'm not in the business of selling hones (though it may be time to cull the herd a bit), and I don't have any real preferences when it comes to hones. I keep a Charnley, a La Verte and a thuringian in the bathroom for quick touch-ups. They seem to work for me. My Oozuku (the only JNat I use on razors these days) is too heavy to use frequently.

Originally Posted by kcb5150

That's really cool. I've used chisels to break in a trans ark after lapping, but I haven't done much with washitas. I had a NO. 1 norton awhile back and some other examples. The cutting power on them calms down quite a bit with use if you don't refresh the surface. The no 1 actually cut rather fine

I've had a couple of no 1s. They can be all over the place, but all of them cut quickly if you lap the surface, and they make a nice razor bevel setter. If they are left to settle in, they do a good job pre polishing and they can work as a razor hone in a pinch, but probably not for beginners.

Anyway, they make a wonderful tool stone, but few people use them because most of them are unlabeled, the labeled ones are expensive, and it's probably difficult for a beginner to get much out of them. Such is any hobby worth doing, I guess - it takes some time to develop the skill, and if it didn't, there wouldn't be much satisfaction.

Wauv you guys really love your rocks! :-) just don't let the argument get to heated.

The original title were about specific labels and other old coticules. But that is a kind of nonsense. All coticules are millions of years old. The different layers may be different, but there is also difference from stones from the same layer.

I have 6 coticules and love them all. One is extremely fast but can also finish fine. I have a greenish one that finish great but is slow.

I have a large naturel combo that will finish any razor and a very small one, that is almost brown. That one is my favourite for smiling edge razors.

All are great, all is wonderful and my hones are better then yours :-)

You guys are making me feel a little better about potentially selling my old rock coticule in the future. I don't have much reason to keep it other than that it was a gift, but it was not given with the condition to never sell it, it was given in exchange for helping someone sell a pile of frictionites on ebay and shipping them for them.

I had considered it unsaleable, but there seems to be enough guys who like that sort of thing that I think I might dump it.

Originally Posted by DaveW

You guys are making me feel a little better about potentially selling my old rock coticule in the future. I don't have much reason to keep it other than that it was a gift, but it was not given with the condition to never sell it, it was given in exchange for helping someone sell a pile of frictionites on ebay and shipping them for them.

I had considered it unsaleable, but there seems to be enough guys who like that sort of thing that I think I might dump it.

If you're willing to deal with the Ebay thing (I personally hate selling on the bay) then it should sell fairly quick. Plenty of rare stone collectors out there. I still kind of cringe every time I see a boxed Escher sell for $500+

I think I paid a grand total of $300 combined for my labeled Eschers. Coti's can fetch a good price as well. Though it seems that La Lune's and Eschers dominate the rare market these days.

Originally Posted by scag315

If you're willing to deal with the Ebay thing (I personally hate selling on the bay) then it should sell fairly quick. Plenty of rare stone collectors out there. I still kind of cringe every time I see a boxed Escher sell for $500+

I think I paid a grand total of $300 combined for my labeled Eschers. Coti's can fetch a good price as well. Though it seems that La Lune's and Eschers dominate the rare market these days.

Yeah the old rock will go fast on the bay.
And I just sold an escher for 500...no box. They always go for more this time of year.

So when is the best time of year to buy ? I'd like to know that......

The height of summer