Thread: getting an edge with a coticule

fxt913, I had no idea that the coticule was a oil stone first and then a waterstone. a lot of what i read before buying said to only use water and didn't say anything about keeping a stone without using slurry for a "finisher" i suppose since i have two stones now (ugh) i can try this method.

----I lived in Belgium for a while....in mid-nineties..... and that is where I bought my first coticule. I was not happy with it, but was doing fine with my small (5x1) thuringian after as a finisher! The barbers I went to all were using coticules (but not openly offering straight razor shaves, only shavete, so you had to ask and beg...), and told me that "green" german waterhones are nowhere near as good as oilhones.....like coticules (used as oilstones for centuries), french, greek, turkish etc... They were using other oil hones to finish as well.....some weird, small black (now I think were likely Pierre de la Lune...), or black with white patches ones... and even told me coticules used to be sold with two three oil bottles (thin-thicker..). I was able to get very decent edges with oil or lather from coticules on several old Solingen carbon blades back then, and later on (from 2006 onward) superb edges after eventually following on Surgical black arkansas......but the "newer" ice hardened and/or sweedish steel blades did not do as well. Otherwise, my small thuri fixed everything for me all the time!

I must say we are getting spoiled these days with jnats, where we are experiencing higher levels of sharpness, and smoothness, and what used to be excellent edges in the past are "only" mediocre now. It puzzles me though that oilstones in general seem out of fashion for razors (some say they are messy....to me they are less messy, as they need two drops only), and even vendors dedicated to selling coticules (not just synthetics) seem to avoid the subject. We are lucky to have the many choices available now, so have a great time trying them all yourself, and stick to what you like!

I would suggest that you neither sell nor buy anything till checking in with Modine. Unless you plan on doing a lot of honing, you really may not need anything else. Mike can help you figure out which coticule might be best to keep. Of course, if it were me I would keep both!

Originally Posted by Utopian

I would suggest that you neither sell nor buy anything till checking in with Modine. Unless you plan on doing a lot of honing, you really may not need anything else. Mike can help you figure out which coticule might be best to keep. Of course, if it were me I would keep both!

I cannot agree more! Any more money thrown at this will not make up for lack of knowledge. In fact you might end up selling the better one. I would say go buy Mike a six pack, and be all ears!

Originally Posted by Marshal

I'm not sure how much help it will be, but this is how things went with my coticule:

http://straightrazorpalace.com/honin...-me-drink.html

Enumerated in that thread is every step I took to get an edge from my stone. Including burnishing it, and use with oils. I don't know about 'oilstone first' as everything I see about modern usage is with water. But I do know that historically they were used with just about everything.

That thread is quite informative, and funny! It mirrors my impressions, and interpretations, to a T! Finishing on a burnished surface with oil is as good as it gets for a coticule. Just do not ever use slurry on that surface...but of course using a good jnat awasedo nagura in it is a whole other subject!!! Cannot say the same for running water...but did not try it long enough to be an expert in it.

I can say this about running water with my stone, I had an edge shaving perfectly fine off a Norton 8K and it degraded the edge. So basically every technique, diluticot, unicot, running water, shave lather, burnishing, oil etc. will have varying degrees of success based on your individual stone. It's sort of weird to me because every other natural stone in my possession has the same straight forward manual of arms. Whether it's my Jnat, Cnat, Arkansas stone, any one of my 3 Welsh slates, or whatever else I may be forgetting they all work more or less the same just with varying degrees of keenness/polish. The coticule is the oddball.

Just to echo what's been said, wait until you catch up with Modine so he can assess them. He can tell you which, if either, of them is a keeper. Or maybe they're both good, no way to tell until they've been in the hands of someone with experience. That's also why I suggested keeping both when I suggested obtaining synthetic hones - so you could assess them yourself and figure out which you like better when you've got the skill to make a good judgment call. Meant to say that in my last post but got hit with a rush at work and left it half completed.

Man... I am just humbled by the supportive responses here. I'll see if i can get some info/direction from Mike, but the response has been outstanding from members near and far, and definitely given me a Lot of different approaches to try in the mean time. I will continue to try on the coticules as well as the synthetic hones i have on the way, and will update on progress (no matter how long it takes)

OK, what synthetic hones did you buy?

Originally Posted by Utopian

OK, what synthetic hones did you buy?

I have a chosera 1000 on the way as of today. I was also going to order a norton 4000/8000 but am definitely open to some advice on that. have checked the b/s/t area and it unfortunately looks like there isn't a lot in the way of used synthetics on there.

OK, if you want to stay minimal, then that 1k and and one of your coticules can, if you choose, be all that you need. Setting the bevels is the most important part of honing and that 1k is a great tool for that task. The coticule can take you the rest of the way. Of course, if you want to be able to do it faster you can try those other synthetics.

Good to know, I was starting to get the impression that the coticule may not be the toold for the job. but if i just need a good bevel setter and a coticule, then i'll keep at it!
No luck finding anyone in the area with time to help show me the ropes in terms of honing, but i'll keep looking and maybe even ask around at the local barber shops (there are a few in the area)
Thanks again to everyone who has offered good help!