Thread: simple honing under the stereo scope

Blues, I wondered when you were going to give it a try..... I figured you would be way to curious to not to :} good to hear that it worked out for you!

rez, I haven't done the 1k edge before, unless the fine stone in the smiths tri-hone set counts as it doesn't say what grit it is. I don't think its so much about shaving off a 6k that has some folks wondering, but the use of the burr as a indication of when to stop each step instead of trying to not ever raise a burr.

Joe, I think both of those apply. People doubting a shaveable 6K edge and people doubting the bur method. There was much controversy a while back about a Japanese blade makers sharpening technique, in part because it was translated, but also it involved the back and forth honing. In some regards the straight razor honing community can be quite rigid.

I'm surprised no one has brought it up but deliberately chasing a burr on razors will lead to more wear. How much exactly I dunno but certainly more than just alternating laps.

I guess you have to decide if your razor is a sacrificial tool. There are a lot of guys here with razors in the 200 year vintage who may be cringing at this thread

Multiple strokes on one side is certainly the faster method & a valid skill for restoration but to use it as a regular honing technique is excessive IMHO.

rez, I remember back before almost all of livi's videos were taken down, there were a couple good ones that showed him making a razor and then at the end honing it, and somewhere in there, he explained that the forward motion is to cut, and the rearward motion is to smooth, all of those vids were not in English, but just by watching them, I could understand what his hands were doing without the explanations. wish they were still there.


onimaru, that is something that I should have put in that video, that you wouldn't need to go through the whole thing every time or before every shave.

Originally Posted by caltoncutlery

rez, I remember back before almost all of livi's videos were taken down, there were a couple good ones that showed him making a razor and then at the end honing it, and somewhere in there, he explained that the forward motion is to cut, and the rearward motion is to smooth, all of those vids were not in English, but just by watching them, I could understand what his hands were doing without the explanations. wish they were still there.


onimaru, that is something that I should have put in that video, that you wouldn't need to go through the whole thing every time or before every shave.

All good.
I just didn't want our members to think doing a "Ripley " & nuking the planet from orbit was a regular honing procedure

Livi was also a knife maker prior to making razors so the concept is no doubt endemic in that field. I always use it on knives & broadheads that need the extra work & even razors that are in need of restoring.

I for one appreciate your experimenting and openly sharing it. I watched one of your videos last night. One thing I’ve never tried is a stropping stroke for finishing on a hone, definitely trying that. Worst case scenario is if doesn’t work for me. I’ll try most anything with in reason in the chase for that perfect for me edge.

Originally Posted by bluesman7

In the interest of expanding on this idea from the OP.

At the meet we discussed the low cost and availability of the King 1k/6k. Today I experimented with Double Arrow modified to a 17 degree bevel angle. I'm pretty sure that the razor was shave ready before starting, but figured that raising a burr on each side with the King 6k would cancel any effect of this head start.

I purposely did not use a loupe or microscope at any time in the experiment.

I raised a burr on the one side with back and forth half laps on the 6k, then repeated on the other side. I then did about 20 alternating edge trailing stropping strokes on the 6k. I followed this with a fair amount of palm stropping. Then I did 10 laps on a CrOx loaded cotton belt that I laid flat on the edge of a table. I cleaned the blade and followed with a poly secondary then my boarhide leather strop. The HHT was excellent. The shave was very close, bordering on harsh but I would have no problem using this edge daily. I have no doubt that I could strop this into a very well behaved edge. I am surprised at how well this system worked.

Update on this razor;

I used the razor again today. Before the shave I did three light, low pressure laps on a slack leather strop followed by 55 regular strop laps. The edge was calmed down considerably and still yielded a very close, but now irritation free, shave. I'm amazed at how well this edge came out.

I have always set a bevel from scratch using half-strokes as described on http://www.coticule.be/strokes.html

I generally follow the half-strokes once i feel the bevel is correctly set with a set of circles followed by X-strokes. Before I move to the next stone in my progressions, I do a couple of spine leading weight of the razor strokes. As I move up the grits, I use a small number of half-strokes and circles and increase the number of X-strokes, but still end with a couple of spine leading strokes before moving to the next stone.

I finish with X-strokes on my finishing stone.

I have a fairly economical setup: Shapton 1k => Norton 4K/8k => Vermio or OOzuko.

This progression seems to work for me and it seems similar to what Joe describes with the exception that I do not check for a burr. I use the thumb pad test instead.

Great video. Deliberately chasing a burr every time might lead to a very slight bit more wear but if you only hone until you just see it form under a scope it isn't going to be a significant difference. Anyone who thinks that they can hone with any other method just until the bevels meet at a perfect apex without removing any excess steel is fooling themselves IMO. I demonstrated on another board that a burr that can be felt and seen with a 10x loupe (got to use the light correctly at the right angle) can be raised with a Chosera 1k in a matter of less than a minute of honing. Some guys spend considerably more time than that on a 1k "not raising a burr." Regardless, whatever method gets you there is A-OK by me.

I have found the "back honing" or spine leading method a useful technique at times as well. I have gotten some outstanding edges that are very much like a Feather Pro blade using such techniques with JNats. Good stuff and experimenting is fun. I haven't been doing so much lately though, sadly.

A sharp edge can be built in many ways but how durable is it ?
Seeing how long it survives just using a strop as maintenance would be a good follow up experiment. Of course that would be a measure of the steel as well.