Naniwa Hones - Need some Help !!!

[BrentonC]

Greetings Gents,

I'm afraid this is installment #2 of the same complaint I've had before about honing with Naniwa 5k, 8k, and 12K hones.

In round 1, I discovered, and it was confirmed here, that there's some kind of soft coating on these stones that needs to be rubbed off, which I thought I did, with my DMT 325.

Well here's the on going problem. Every time I sharpen my razor, I actually make it duller than when I started. By use of my pasted paddle strop, I'm able to get it sharper again, but never sharp enough. After about a year of str8 shaving, shaves are still no where near as close a shave as I get with my DE.

So back to honing. I've used the DMT on each hone for probably 30 minutes each, in total. They still feel smooth as silk to the touch. Still make my razor duller, not sharper.

Before I throw down the gauntlet, and demand satisfaction with a sledge hammer (pictures of the aftermath to be posted here), can any one think of what may help?

Are these stones just garbage? Could it be that they need to be ground on with the DMT for 14 hours, and I'm just not patient enough?

I've watched the videos on honing technique and have worked diligently to perform that technique properly.

I'd like to really make progress with this straight shaving thing, but it surely should't be this difficult (read: completely impossible, no matter what) to get some sharpness on my blade.

Thanks in advance for any tips.

Please forgive any frustration that leaks through in my post.

[JimmyHAD]

Sorry that you are having problems with them. The first thing that comes to mind is if there is anyone who is a good honer in your area ? Another forum member perhaps ? Let another experienced hand use them and see what they think. I've got the whole set of Naniwas from 1k through 12k and I think they are great. What brand hones had you been using before the naniwas ? Maybe just a period of adjustment is what it will take.

[holli4pirating]

I mean no disrespect here, but have you ever successfully honed a straight razor before? It could well be that it is you and not the hones.

I don't mean to challenge the "coating" statement - I don't really know one way or the other, but I honed up at least 10 razors on my Naniwa 5k and 8k right out of the box without lapping them.

[BrentonC]

Thanks for the speedy replies, guys. No offence taken, by any means.

They're Superstones, it says on the boxes, and there's a bunch of oriental writing there too. Is Superstones the brand name?

These are the first hones I've had. My razor is a T-I, and while it was supposed to be shave ready, it really wasn't. A local guy sharpened it up for me, and then, after I got the hones, gave me a bit of a lesson with them, but obviously I missed something.

He actually said he liked the stones, and he had a bit of a collection of his own going.

So, I may be the proverbial poor craftsman who's blaming his tools. So many inter dependent skills to acquire in this hobby, that it's just kept me baffled.

Could well be my technique.

[BKratchmer]

Thanks for the speedy replies, guys. No offence taken, by any means.

They're Superstones, it says on the boxes, and there's a bunch of oriental writing there too. Is Superstones the brand name?

These are the first hones I've had. My razor is a T-I, and while it was supposed to be shave ready, it really wasn't. A local guy sharpened it up for me, and then, after I got the hones, gave me a bit of a lesson with them, but obviously I missed something.

He actually said he liked the stones, and he had a bit of a collection of his own going.

So, I may be the proverbial poor craftsman who's blaming his tools. So many inter dependent skills to acquire in this hobby, that it's just kept me baffled.

Could well be my technique.

I bet it's your technique... not to be insulting, again... just because it is hard to learn. I've been practicing for a few months now, and it still usually takes me several tries with any specific razor before I get it right.

Hang in there, read in the Wiki, ask lots of questions here, and see if that local guy will show you the ropes again.

[gugi]

superstones is a line of the naniwa production.

mine are most definitely not crap and work really well. i know they work really well for lynn, glen, and max as well.

may be you should reconnect to the local person who gave you the demo.

[JimmyHAD]

Are you drawing a pencil grid on the hones when you lap ? Lapping under running water works best for me to clear the swarf so as not to get an uneven surface.

Here is Lynn honing at Razor Con '09. Study that a bit. Also, a new TI isn't the best way to start learning to hone. If you could find some decent but cheap vintage razors around town or on the bay it might be better. That way if you put excessive wear on it you won't feel as bad as if it is your TI. Just make sure they are full blades without excessive wear already.

[BrentonC]

Maybe I better give him a call. I'm just not "getting the picture" from watching and trying to practice the techniques from the demo videos, but obviously you guys learned how to do this, proving that it can be done.

I tell you it's really been baffling to me.

One thing I wondered is whether the T-I razor was sharpened with a double bevel, or what ever it's called, like by putting tape on the side of the spine. I thought that could account for honing and honing and honing with not effect.

But once I tape the spine -- I guess I'm stuck with that, unless doing a bevel reset.

[BrentonC]

Thanks for the Link, Jimmy,

I 'll study that carefully.

Yes, I was lapping under running water, and the first time I lapped, I drew a grid. Not subsequently, though. Maybe that's not a short cut to be taking.

Good point on getting another, more expendable razor for practice.

[niftyshaving]

Greetings Gents,

I'm afraid this is installment #2 of the same complaint I've had before about honing with Naniwa 5k, 8k, and 12K hones.
....snip...
Please forgive any frustration that leaks through in my post.

A leak, eek -- calls for a styptic pencil.

Try this.
Starting with the fine one first, lap each hone just a little with your DMT
underwater in a bucket or the sink. No pencil grid, just a gentle lapping.
The order is just to eliminate transferring coarse grit to the fine hone with
the DMT, running water is OK. No soaking is needed as far as I know.

Using light strokes, hone with lap ratios that match the grit.
With one drop of dish soap in the bucket... rinse the hone
and...

N*5 laps on the 5k
N*8 laps on the 8k
N*12 laps on the 12K.

Start with N=2 i.e.

10 laps on the 5k
16 laps on the 8k
24 laps on the 12K.

Nice smooth deliberate laps angle the blade so the full width of
the blade and the hone match up. No "fancy" X strokes
unless the razor needs it.

Strop smoothly... and shave test.