Thread: Piece of History: A Canadian talks about American's

Originally Posted by crouton976

In my 31 years (just because I'm young doesn't mean I don't have insight) I've held many different views on how the world at large works. Some of those views I still believe in, but most of them have changed with age, and especially after becoming a father.

As I see it, the largest problem with this country is the people's complacency with being told how they will live and their general laziness to break that cycle. It's like a train wreck for them... they see how horrible things are becoming, but just can't look away in spite of themselves.

What the hell ever happened to personal responsibility? What the hell ever happened to being an individual, self sufficient enough to run your daily life without a government, boss, manager, councilman/councilwoman, teacher, spouse etc. telling you what to do and how to do it? Are we sheep? Children? Invalids?

The bottom line is we are responsible for US, and anyone who is as fed up as I am should be taking action, not sitting idly by and watching as our nation falls to ruin.

We have politicians, on both sides of the aisle, who do nothing to look out for our best interest. Jesus, take Common Core for example... It serves no purpose but lining wallets. No testing. No studies. No results. Just released to "market" and forced on the American people. What major corporation would release a product without vigorous testing and research first?

And what happens when people speak out against it? They're arrested, like the gentleman in MD.

If we're so sick of how things are going, change it. By force, if necessary (though hopefully not). But the first thing to do is get off our lazy asses.

In the words of Howard Beale: I don't have to tell you things are bad. Everybody knows things are bad. It's a depression. Everybody's out of work or scared of losing their job. The dollar buys a nickel's worth. Banks are going bust. Shopkeepers keep a gun under the counter. Punks are running wild in the street and there's nobody anywhere who seems to know what to do, and there's no end to it. We know the air is unfit to breathe and our food is unfit to eat, and we sit watching our TVs while some local newscaster tells us that today we had fifteen homicides and sixty-three violent crimes, as if that's the way it's supposed to be.
We know things are bad — worse than bad. They're crazy. It's like everything everywhere is going crazy, so we don't go out anymore. We sit in the house, and slowly the world we are living in is getting smaller, and all we say is: 'Please, at least leave us alone in our living rooms. Let me have my toaster and my TV and my steel-belted radials and I won't say anything. Just leave us alone.'
Well, I'm not gonna leave you alone. I want you to get MAD! I don't want you to protest. I don't want you to riot — I don't want you to write to your congressman, because I wouldn't know what to tell you to write. I don't know what to do about the depression and the inflation and the Russians and the crime in the street. All I know is that first you've got to get mad. [shouting] You've got to say: 'I'm a human being, god-dammit! My life has value!'
So, I want you to get up now. I want all of you to get up out of your chairs. I want you to get up right now and go to the window. Open it, and stick your head out, and yell: I'M AS MAD AS HELL, AND I'M NOT GOING TO TAKE THIS ANYMORE!
I want you to get up right now. Sit up. Go to your windows. Open them and stick your head out and yell - 'I'm as mad as hell and I'm not gonna take this anymore!' Things have got to change. But first, you've gotta get mad!...You've got to say, I'M AS MAD AS HELL, AND I'M NOT GOING TO TAKE THIS ANYMORE! Then we'll figure out what to do about the depression and the inflation and the oil crisis. But first, get up out of your chairs, open the window, stick your head out, and yell, and say it: I'M AS MAD AS HELL, AND I'M NOT GOING TO TAKE THIS ANYMORE!

I love this enthusiasm but can't help but feel slightly cautious about encouraging the masses into action. You hear it said very often that we all want the same things in life but that we simply differ on how to go about it. It's a polite way to put an end to a disagreement over fundamental issues. But in reality I don't believe it to be true at all. Before people go screaming from the rooftops and mobilizing into action I would advise to spend some time really thinking about what it is that we came from and where it is that we want to go. Ther is a reason why we are at civil war levels of division in this country.

OCDshaver, I agree that people need to figure out what they want and where we're going, however, my point is that unless, as stated before, you get sick and tired of being sick and tired change will never come.

To that end, even if you have no idea what you want, reaching the point where you know what we have doesn't work and vowing to change it takes motivation.

Do I have all the answers? No, I don't... merely suggestions. Do we as a people? Possibly. Does change need to occur? Absolutely.

Am I motivated? You can set your watch and warrant on it.

This doesn't mean go all gung-ho and throw any logic out the window, quite the contrary.

I think that change is underway already to some extent. As I watch the news this evening and anticipate a thread on what seems like an inevitable shut down of govt, I can't help but see that change already in progress. The Tea Party is a big part of that change. Demonized as it is by many, I believe that it IS demonized because it represents a change. And it is a change to fundamental practices and attempts to put the brakes on what has been an ongoing and gradual shift in public perception of govt and society. It cuts so close to the bone that it is despised by both republicans and democrats. And yet there is very little to their message - constitutional govt, protection of our borders, and fiscal responsibility (an amendment requiring a balanced budget) being the most prominent. And even though I disagree with their current battle over Obamacare that will likely force a shutdown of the govt, you can't deny the power this small group (a minority of half of the House of Representaives) is having on the national debate. So threatened by this change, the administration turned the wrath of the IRS against them. This is significant change but it won't happen overnight. And we have to remember that the general populace in this country has always been somewhat apathetic when it comes to govt. When the Declaration of Independence was signed it was hardly signed with the consent of the entire population. Many people, although sympathetic to the cause, we're not overly committed to fighting the kings army. The federalist papers were more or less a series of explanations to the populace as to what the new constitution was to be all about and to offer assurance that the "plan" was worthy. The average person, to no real fault of their own, prefers to go about the business of work, family, paying bills, having BBQs, and living life. The debate between one side or the other takes place within a small segment of the population. And when that majority if called upon to weigh in on the debate, their ignorance is used against them.

Originally Posted by OCDshaver

And when that majority if called upon to weigh in on the debate, their ignorance is used against them.

Therein lies the problem, and solution. If you're not ignorant it can't be used against you or to others advantage.

Well the way I see the whole melting pot thing is thusly: America has never really been a melting pot. It may have seemed more so in the past, but that's only because in the past government programs/laws promoting and validating individuals rights weren't as pro-active as they are now.

Can't blame republicans or democrats for making America a more gentle place for immigrants - it has always been in America's best interests to encourage immigration. Every social program here is based on the notion of population growth. Everyone has encouraged immigration as they raped these programs knowing population would grow (and make up the difference).

It's business - and no one talks about it - because then they would have to fix it - an no party wants to admit they are stealing from the public lol!! It's true!!

DUDES - its a Ponzi scheme the likes many can't even fathom.

Originally Posted by OCDshaver

I love this enthusiasm but can't help but feel slightly cautious about encouraging the masses into action. You hear it said very often that we all want the same things in life but that we simply differ on how to go about it. It's a polite way to put an end to a disagreement over fundamental issues. But in reality I don't believe it to be true at all. Before people go screaming from the rooftops and mobilizing into action I would advise to spend some time really thinking about what it is that we came from and where it is that we want to go. Ther is a reason why we are at civil war levels of division in this country.

Originally Posted by crouton976

OCDshaver, I agree that people need to figure out what they want and where we're going, however, my point is that unless, as stated before, you get sick and tired of being sick and tired change will never come.

To that end, even if you have no idea what you want, reaching the point where you know what we have doesn't work and vowing to change it takes motivation.

Do I have all the answers? No, I don't... merely suggestions. Do we as a people? Possibly. Does change need to occur? Absolutely.

Am I motivated? You can set your watch and warrant on it.

This doesn't mean go all gung-ho and throw any logic out the window, quite the contrary.

Not sure but I do believe I have heard something somewhere that might fit what you guys are saying


"When in the Course of human events, it becomes necessary for one people to dissolve the political bands which have connected them with another, and to assume among the powers of the earth, the separate and equal station to which the Laws of Nature and of Nature's God entitle them, a decent respect to the opinions of mankind requires that they should declare the causes which impel them to the separation."

Originally Posted by gssixgun

Not sure but I do believe I have heard something somewhere that might fit what you guys are saying


"When in the Course of human events, it becomes necessary for one people to dissolve the political bands which have connected them with another, and to assume among the powers of the earth, the separate and equal station to which the Laws of Nature and of Nature's God entitle them, a decent respect to the opinions of mankind requires that they should declare the causes which impel them to the separation."

LOL - and Canadian's always worried about Quebec separating .

Originally Posted by Brenngun

Therein lies the problem, and solution. If you're not ignorant it can't be used against you or to others advantage.

Or, as Crouton we can do something and instead make an effort to take back public education from the left in this country, the news sources, the movie/tv industry and begin using the same tactics that the left has employed for quite some time.

Ah, screw it... I'm writing in Glen for President. I can see it now: instead of the shave test, he'll invent the no B.S. test and the new political party created around his Presidency will use JimmyHAD's avatar.

Should be epic.

On a serious note, I agree that the Tea Party is a small but formidable force, and the ideals they're supporting scare the crap out of the rest of our governing body. Even when you have such a small group, truth and logic are a powerful thing to stand against.

Interestingly, if you haven't heard of the Free State Project, check them out. It just goes to show what 1,000 people can do in a state of 4.5 million. Their goal is 20,000 people. We're actually considering making the move. If not, we'll probably shoot for Montana, Idaho or Texas (in that order). We're both just tired of the rat race and want more independence.

Originally Posted by OCDshaver

Or, as Crouton we can do something and instead make an effort to take back public education from the left in this country, the news sources, the movie/tv industry and begin using the same tactics that the left has employed for quite some time.

Why does everyone that leans a little right think that education leans left? That confuses me.

OK - so note I am talking higher education here.

I have just completed 6 years of business school in America's heartland and brother... there were more Tea Party, Republican Party, Libertarian want-to-be's than anything.

Of course I am but one data point - but University's here really, really, rely on their endowments... and from what I have seen, those who give to endowment funds influence how the college leans.

Are you saying more left leaning people contribute to colleges? Cuz only that would explain your thinking?