Thread: New Immigration bill is TREASON

Like Spanish people?? I sure hope so !
Folks, I'm sure what you have heard about the new immigration bill.
This is bad. This is really bad.
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http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/immigrati..._RiLywGA_Cs0NU
This threatens Social Security. It is a slap in the face to every person who has gone through all the legal hoops to get their citizenship/permanent residency.

Right is right and wrong is wrong. If you snuck in then you are a criminal.
PERIOD ! Do we want criminals to stay? Do we want to reward criminal behavior?
What makes you think illegals will follow the NEW laws when they didn't follow the old laws?

If they don't comply what are we going to do? Deport them?
WE CAN DEPORT PEOPLE NOW AND WE DON'T DO IT !!!!!!!!!

OK, so you want to be a nice guy and give amnesty to illegals??
America is a nation of immigrants you say? NOT ILLEGAL IMMIGRANTS !

Stop being such a sissy and email your senator or rep and tell them to vote NO on a $2.5 TRILLION aid bill to Mexico.

I'm a nice guy but lets look at reality here folks. Do the math !

I've been paying into SS all my life. The law says 10 years gets you in for $19,000 a year.
Lets say 15% of these 12 Mil(bogus number for sure) are 50 and will get SS in 15 years.
So 15% of 12 mil is 1.8 mil X $19,000 per year = $34.2 BILLION per year
The average person collects SS for 19 years THATS 649.8 BILLION !!!
Think of how much of this goes back to the home country! Can we afford to have this much money sucked out of our economy?
Thats just one little tiny bit of math
Now add in if 25% have one child.
I can't find a website who has done math right now but I am quite sure the cost of public education is ave $9600 per child per year.
Get an immigrant with 4 kids thats $40, a year even without entitlements.
Thats 3,000,000 X 9,600 = 28.8 BILLION a year

Effects of immigration on native born unemployment rates.
http://www.cis.org/articles/2006/back806.html
Furthermore, research shows that white males working in an area with recent Spanish speaking immigrants make on average $1 less per hour than in a less racially diverse community.

Don't like math? Read this.
http://www.cis.org/articles/2007/mskoped050207.html



Email your state rep and tell them no. Even if you think this bill is a good idea do it anyway. Be a good American and DO IT !

http://www.senate.gov/general/contac...nators_cfm.cfm

202-224-3121 Senate Switchboard
202-225-3121 Congress Switchboard

Pray for country

Opps, gave link to the senate, not reps. Email anyway.
do it X10

btw, I know lots of people think that $5000 to apply is a good number.
I went and thought about what it cost my wife to get legal and it was close to 20K. Very close.

and to think she has the nerve to bitch about me buying razors !!!

The 12 million number is based on the 2000 census. I wouldn't be suprised if the real number is more like 25 to 30 million. It is estimated that these people cost the tax payers 16,000 to 20,000 per year in services now. If they are allowed to become legal, that cost will rise.

I live in California and have been watching this since the early '90s. I've seen hospitals closing and the education system go down hill. I spent seven years working in a Home Depot located in a Hispanic area. The immigrants, would get upset with employees that looked Hispanic and didn't speak Spanish. One was a Navaho and one was from India.

Do these people have some special desirable qualities that the Senate is bending over backwards to give them everything? Most of them are uneducated and poor. Aside from a low cost labor force, they have little to offer the country. Them being here eases the burden on Mexico to provide jobs and services for them. While it costs the US taxpayer, it is a plus to Mexico. These Immigrants send Billions back too their families.

"They pay their taxes." Don't make me laugh. The only tax they pay is sales tax. You need a SSN or a Tax Payer ID to pay state and federal taxes. If they have an SSN, I'll bet that it is probably a fake.

Sorry to all for the venting but this is one of my hot buttons and I call the Senate Bill a SELL OUT.

this was something that was known was going to happen. It has to happen for the frasier institute in initation it's new amero currency. Our economy has to totaly collapse so a new money can be used in canda, mexico, us, and some south american countries. It has been widely talked about before on the news that social security would have to fail to totally destroy the american economy so that this would be instituted. Also I have allready seen advertisements selling amero silver coins in a coin collector magazine. Yes this will destroy our economy as it was intended to do.

An Alternate view...
All this tough talk about immigration has me thinking what happened to the Irish Italians and other Europeans who came to US in the late nineteenth and early 20th century. Many of those who came had no papers.
Ellis Island was only established in the early 20th century and not everyone who came went through Ellis Island.
There was all the doom and gloom talk about these new immigrants not integrating into the American way of life. People said it was the end of America. And look what has happened to the country since.....

Then in the 1960s the Chinese faced similar problems infact Immigration from China was banned.

The reason we learn about history is because it helps us understand and learn from our past. Have we learned nothing?

All the economic arguments made against immigration there just as many and even more that can be made for it.

Before jumping to statements like "Treason" and "sellout" I would consider the pros and cons and then make a decision. Do what is best for this country not what a radio talk show host with a conservative or liberal agenda has ranted about to get some ratings.

Lets learn from our history and consider the consequences on doing nothing.

Certainly the illegal alien situation in the US today is complex.

My impression of immigration pre-WWI was that it was comprised primarily of two cases... those that immigrated here for political/religious freedoms and those that were brought here somewhat/totally against their will (eg. slaves, Chinese railroad workers, etc.). The majority case was those seeking freedoms, and they truly immigrated... ie, they intended to make this their new country, complete with allegiances, learning the language, become citizens, etc. And mostly, they did.

But for the past 50 or so years, another situation has developed... those that came here illegally with no intent of immigrating (ie, no intention of staying... no allegiance to the USA, no intention to learn the language, no intention of becoming a citizen, etc.). Rather, they came here mostly to take advantage of the ability to earn a fast buck. And now that there are significant numbers of these people, it's affecting our economy and our society.

If you believe they're doing jobs that Americans won't do for that salary... you're wrong. There's much more to it when you look beneath the surface... mostly having to do with corruption, payoffs, drugs, sex slaves, etc... much that same as occurred in the 1800's.

If you believe our current unemployment rate of 4.5% validates that there are no citizens available to do the work anyway... you're wrong. The unemployment rate, AFAIK, does not include people who have not found a job by the time their unemployment benefits run out (in AZ that's 6-mo)... the assumption is that if you can't find a job in 6-mo you "don't really want to work". I'm sure that's true for some, but consider those people over-55 whoe are unemployed... these are the workers that were laid off (or downsized, outsourced, or whatever) that have never been able to find gainful employment. There's lots of people in this situation... and they would gladly do many of the jobs that the illegals are doing for the pay the illegals are getting... instead they are on public assistance (or will be once the use up all of their retirement nest-egg while trying to find work). How many kids in economically depressed areas can't find jobs... so they go on welfare... it's become their culture.

I believe the real truth is employers would rather hire the illegals... so they can get kickbacks, sexual favors, fire them without cause, use them as drug runners, etc. It's almost slavery...

Now, what does all this cost the American taxpayer? Well, printing all those forms and signs and directions in Spanish isn't cheap. It's costing us a huge sum in the healthcare arena... most illegals simply go to the emergency room for all their healthcare needs and never have to pay. School systems, hospitals, police, etc. have to hire interpreters so the Doctors/nurses/teachers/cops can talk to them. Advertising circulars get bigger so they can be dual language. And the new trend, which is the ultimate absurdity, is many employers are now requiring Americans to learn Spanish (on their own nickel) so they can talk to the illegals.

I have compassion for someone who truly wants to immigrate. But I have no compassion for someone who wants, effectively, to steal from me and my country.

Last year I was stopped at a red light and my car was rear-ended by some illegals in a pickup truck... they had Mexican drivers licenses, no insurance, and were here illegally. The cops could have cared less... it's a jurisdictional thing... an "INA problem, not a city police issue" according to them. The damage exceeded the value of my car... and so that cost me... all in support of "allowing illegals to be here illegally".


Amny, I am thinking about what's best for the USA... and I can only conclude that illegal immigration is costing us big time... both in a degradation of our society and our pocketbooks.

just my $.02

Azjoe took the words right out of my mouth. I agree wholeheartedly. We don't need to learn a second language. If you want to live here you need to adopt our language. You need to go through the proper legal channels and then swear allegiance to the American flag. When our country was formed they voted whether English or German would be our official language. Enough said!!
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Del

I wasn't going to post here because I've done my share of posting in these controversial threads but I also am in agreement with AZ JOE.

There is no question in my mind that illegal immigration does cause some socio economic problems especially in border towns. There is no denying that. The question is how do we resolve

1. The economic costs
By bringing the those who are illegal out of the shadows and implementing a strict employment policies we can certainly solve the economic issues. This would mean more people paying taxes rather than getting paid illegally under the table. This will also help increase wages. Not only that it would also mean these individuals would pay back taxes. Plus the fines they would pay for committing the crime of being in the country illegally. Social security would also be alleviated because many of the illegals are younger and years away from retiring. They would now be contributing to a system that needs to be modified. They also become consumers which helps the economy. Majority of those who come to this country seek a better life and ...simply want to have more money (to buy brushes and str8s)
Anyone who says deporting all illegals is simply not approaching this from a practical perspective

2. National Security
By identifying those who are here we can concentrate our efforts in tracking terrorists and drug dealers rather than landscapers, maids, other workers.

3. Changes to our social structure
Looking back at history and looking at the immigrants who came here they integrated into American society after 1 or 2 generations. These immigrants in my opinion will do the same. America has always assimilated its immigrants and not the other way around. This country is a better place for it now.

There is no easy solution the problem but doing nothing is worse. We have a problem and we must deal with it now. Yes those who come illegally commit a crime. The questions nobody wants to answer from a practical perspective is what is the appropriate punishment for that. I say the punishment should be monetary..

Sorry for the long post, I am going to go back and smoke my cigar (Cohiba Sigilo IV) and then watch some golf and strop all my str8s

I feel compelled to add to this discussion, simply because many people do not understand what is involved in legally immiigrating to the United States of America.

My family is from Cambodia.


My wife and I were married in spring of 1996 in Phnom Penh. It took 6 mos. for the paperwork to clear, after we were married, before she could join me in the US. In 1998, we applied for her youngest two children to immigrate. In May of 2000, my wife was naturalized as a US citizen, which changed the status of the kids visa applications (from the children of a Permanent Resident to the children of a US citizen - presumably, US citizens have priority), and their applications were approved in late 2000, and the kids arrived shortly thereafter. The eldest was in University, and was over the age (20 at the time) to get a visa as the son/daughter of a US citizen - he was in a different category, and all we could do was 'sponsor' his application.

His application was submitted in October, 2002.

A month and a half ago, we received a letter from USCIS (modern day INS) that stated, in part....

"The above petition has been approved. We have sent the original visa petition to the Department of State National Visa Center (NVC) in Portsmouth, NH. The NVC processes all approved immigrant visa petitions that need consular action....NVC will then forward the approved petition to that consulate."

OK - there was rejoicing in the Scarface household - brother and son would soon be here, and the interminable wait was finally over. The immigration attorney assured us that it was now just a matter of months, and jubilant calls were made overseas. Life was grand in those simpler times.

20 minutes ago, I opened a letter from the National Visa Center. The meat of the letter states:

Unfortunately, visa numbers are not presently available for your use. You will be notified when further consideration can be given to processing your application for immigration. The reason for this delay is that there are more applicants for visas than there are immigrant visa numbers available under the limitation prescribed by law. For some visa categories, for example F3 or F4, this delay could be many years....You are cautioned that you MUST NOT [their emphasis] make any firm plans, such as disposing of property, giving up jobs, or making travel arrangements at this time, We have no way of predicting when it will be possible to proceed with your immigrant visa application. You need not check with us further unless you need to report a change of address....

ie...don't call us...we'll call you.......

Three years ago (which was about 2 years into the process), my wife asked me why can't we bring him to Mexico and across the border (illegally) there. I said, "No, we're doing to do it by the book, so he can get to be a citizen."

...and then I turn on the TV, and see and hear all of the discussions about granting the ILLEGAL, swim-across-the-border-and-now-we're-already-here immigrants legal status and a 'Path to Citizenship', and...this is the one that really burns MY ass....an interview with some illegal immigrants COMPLAINING that the $5000 fine/application fee for processing them to legal status was TOO MUCH!!! I saw one interview where an illegal marching in a demonstration looked into the camera and said

"George Bush should mow MY lawn...and serve MY food....and wash MY dishes!"

Fortunately for me, the beer bottle missed the TV...but it DID leave a big mark on the wall!

This whole thing stinks on ice.

Pardon me if I'm a little down....I need to go console my wife.

-whatever

-Lou