Thread: Slept through 55 tattoos???? - The plot thickens

Just a small note about the dad being (not) there: apparently he agreed on the 3 stars, not on the 56. Then he left, she changed her mind, and the tat artist got to work.

The only thing I hold against the artist is the lack of informed consent from her father. Equally, I can only really hold the girls ignorance against her. The blame is not as simple as 'It's his/her fault'. It's a complex issue and clearly the blame is split between the artist, the girl and her father.

His face is his face and he is free to do with it what he will and I will try my damned hardest not to judge him on that, like I do with every one else. It's kinda depressing that people are so quick to judge a person by how they look - I wonder when they start questioning other peoples prejudices.

Step out of the box a little bit people, rise above societies acceptable prejudices, the world would be a better place.

Originally Posted by gregs656

societies acceptable prejudices

boy I never heard it put that way but you make an excellent point

acceptable eh....... sounds like food for thought
thanks Greg

Originally Posted by gregs656

His face is his face and he is free to do with it what he will and I will try my damned hardest not to judge him on that, like I do with every one else. It's kinda depressing that people are so quick to judge a person by how they look - I wonder when they start questioning other peoples prejudices.

He is free to do what he want: disfigure his face.
I am free to do what I want: take my business elsewhere.
Everything we do is judged.

In this case, my opinion is based on the following things:
1) I found his face physically revolting to look at. It is not something I like to do, he makes me uncomfortable and thus I seek out someone else.
2) He conciously made the decision to place himself so far out of 'the norm'. If he doesn't want to be one of us, then that is how I will treat him.

I will not discriminate against him, I will still help him if I pass him by on the street and he is in trouble, and I will not insult him, tell people not to visit him, call him names or whatever.
All I do is to decide that I don't want to do business with him, as is my right.

Originally Posted by gregs656

Step out of the box a little bit people, rise above societies acceptable prejudices, the world would be a better place.

A minor point of clarification:these are my prejudices, not society's ones. I don't share many of my society's prejudices, but I am perfectly capable of having some of my own.

Btw, if you have actual reasons for your opinion, does it still count as prejudice? For example, the fact that his face repulses me is to me a perfectly acceptable reason for not wanting to have anything to do with him. If it was a medical condition, I would make allowances because it is not his choice. But he chose to be like this.

Originally Posted by Bruno

Imo, if you look like that, you have some issues to work out.

I would not trust his judgement

I would say they are prejudices based on his looks. He might be the most sane person on the planet, he might be the most trustworthy, he might have the best judgement.

One of 'Us'. What an awful statement. 'Us' and 'Them' can only lead you down a dark path.

And yes, it does still count. Everyone who is prejudiced has an 'actual reason', the trouble is, you're not just judging him superficially, you're judging everything else about him based on that - that's a prejudice. And you're making choices based on that.

And I said Societies ACCEPTABLE prejudices, and this is one of them. You go in to a bar and have a good old laugh at this bloke because of how he looks, and no one would bat an eye lid. It's your prejudice, of course it is, but it's permitted by society.

You go in and start ranting about black guys, or gay people, or jewish people, disabled people etc etc etc - and you would make people very uncomfortable - because they are not socially acceptable prejudices.

I really try and live my life with out prejudice, really try. That's because I've met a lot of people from all walks of life - and many of them do not fit the labels placed on them - not even close.

Originally Posted by Bruno

Just a small note about the dad being (not) there: apparently he agreed on the 3 stars, not on the 56. Then he left, she changed her mind, and the tat artist got to work.

Doesn't change it in any way for me. He left his teenage daughter to get a tattoo on her own.

That's just not right.

She's admitted lying now - she wanted the 56 stars, but when daddy got mad, she couldn't take the blame and fobbed it off on the poor artist instead.

'I lied' admits sleepy tattoo girl - oddstuff | Stuff.co.nz

Originally Posted by LX_Emergency

Doesn't change it in any way for me. He left his teenage daughter to get a tattoo on her own.

That's just not right.

his teenage daughter was old enough to have gone and gotten the tattoo WITHOUT her dad, because she has reached the age of consent, yes? It's possible I don't understand how the age of consent works in Europe, so I'm asking a question here.

Where I live, she's old enough to get tattoos, she's considered an adult, and her father wouldn't be part of the equation. Did the dad have to sign a release or something? is she not old enough to get a tattoo on her own in that jurisdiction?

Originally Posted by gregs656

I would say they are prejudices based on his looks. He might be the most sane person on the planet, he might be the most trustworthy, he might have the best judgement.

One of 'Us'. What an awful statement. 'Us' and 'Them' can only lead you down a dark path..

Everybody thinks of themselves as one of us. we are never them. He has chosen to mutilate his body in a way that makes me nauseous by looking at it. He would scare the hell out of my daughters.
So exactly -why- should I be forced to do business with him? Just to show to the world how 'tolerant' I am?

It is his choice to look like that.

Originally Posted by gregs656

And yes, it does still count. Everyone who is prejudiced has an 'actual reason', the trouble is, you're not just judging him superficially, you're judging everything else about him based on that - that's a prejudice. And you're making choices based on that.

Looking at him makes me feel uncomfortable. See the previous paragraph. Why should I be forced to endure the discomfort? It's not by my choice that he looks like that. And if I do business with someone, I would prefer that we have the same basic ideas about the topic at hand. I am after all entrusting my body to him when he puts on the tattoo.

Originally Posted by gregs656

And I said Societies ACCEPTABLE prejudices, and this is one of them. You go in to a bar and have a good old laugh at this bloke because of how he looks, and no one would bat an eye lid. It's your prejudice, of course it is, but it's permitted by society.

Perhaps society would agree with my opinion. I don't care. I am not the type to mock someone in public or to belittle people. But in the confines of my own mind I am free to think what I want, and if I don't want to do business with him based on how he looks, then that is my prerogative. If I find someone else who I do feel comfortable with, why should I be forced to choose someone with whom I do not?

Originally Posted by gregs656

You go in and start ranting about black guys, or gay people, or jewish people, disabled people etc etc etc - and you would make people very uncomfortable - because they are not socially acceptable prejudices.

I do not rant about this guy either. And the only reason I mentioned it is because we were discussing him.
I do not rant about anyone btw. I am the guy that goes into the bar to have a drink and mostly listen to what people have to say. I am good at listening and getting people to talk.

Originally Posted by gregs656

I really try and live my life with out prejudice, really try. That's because I've met a lot of people from all walks of life - and many of them do not fit the labels placed on them - not even close.

I do so too. But effort has to be made on 2 sides, not just one.
You don't choose to be black, jewish, gay, or have a skin condition. But he chose to look like that and broadcast that he doesn't give squat about what other people think. So if he gives me the finger, why should I make an effort to overcome my discomfort and even give him preference, just to show what a great guy I am?

Ok, who said anything about forcing you to do business with him?

It is your prerogative not to do business with him, but you're making that choice based on his looks, and how you assume he must be because of them.

I was speaking hypothetically, if you were to go into a pub . . .

Why does having a tattoed face mean he doesn't care what other people think?

And sure, you don't choose to be any of those things, there are not that many socially unacceptable prejudices when it comes to an action that has choice, but that doesn't make it ok. I just used the obvious ones.

And yes, you should rise above it, not to prove anything, just because it's the right thing to do.