Thread: Help me pick my 9mm

Not sure if it has been suggested, but I'm a huge fan of the Browning (or FN) Hi-Power.

There is really not much difference between all the rounds. The main thing is how the piece suits the owner. Much of the debate is mute if bullet placement is not correct. Over penetration does not matter as most rounds miss the target.

I like guns and shoot paper so the gunfighter aspect is not important to me. The .45 is a little harder to master than some other autos. The S&W model 14 makes it somuch easier to police the brass. The S&W model 17, ah so nice to kick the brass out of your way and leave.

Back to razors I still have a few dozen to bring back to life.

Originally Posted by singlewedge

It is not that I am unwilling to kill. In defense of myself, family or home I would. I challenge anyone to say "they are prepared to kill". Again I restate given the proper operant conditioning anyone can be "prepared to kill", military, police etc., those that lack the appropriate operant conditioning are not prepared to kill. No matter how hardcore someone thinks they are with a gun a human being will always hesitate IF they are not properly conditioned.

I am not properly conditioned. I know this. I am up front with this. I plan on training myself to become conditioned and that will change my stance. Until that happens, I have to be truthful with myself and others. I know that if the time comes I must pull the trigger. That truth does not make the act easier to deal with.

If no one has read the book "On Killing, The psychological cost of learning to kill in war and society" by Grossman I highly recommend picking it up and reading it.

Oddly killing involves much more than pulling a trigger. It involves a dehumanization of the target. Hence Hogan's Alley where "real" looking characters are used for the police. The book describes a sniper school in Israel where the instructor uses ketchup filled cabbage heads dressed in street gear with appropriate faces. The object of the exercise is for the sniper to become "ok" with seeing a head explode and pieces and blood fly everywhere.

To be able to dehumanize a person that is standing in your living room is hard especially at hand gun range. At shotgun range it is probably easier. Anger and fear are probably the driving factors when operant conditioning is not available.

I am prepared to kill. There are lots of really fun courses you can take that will improve your skill with a weapon to the point where you just identify a target then react.

Also


My life philosophy is pretty simple. Those I have allowed into my home are more important than anyone else and anyone who enters my house uninvited means me and mine harm. If the mean harm they have put their life into the balance, if they are willing to take one they must be willing to risk one, and this is a contest I have practiced to win. Anyone who would attack a supposedly defenseless human beingis a lesser being who does deserve to be put down. Their life is simply not as valuable to the world as mine is.

Originally Posted by JimmyHAD

One more comes to mind... Greg LeMond had won a Tour De France and was hunting when a family member mistook him for a deer. He shot him in the stomach with a 12ga deer slug. Not only did LeMond survive but he came back to win the Tour 2 more times.

They were turkey hunting and it was bird shot. He still has 37 pellets in his body. If it was deer slugs he wouldn't be around.

All calibres have pros and cons, there is no best calibre if there was there would only be one.

Best advice is get a gun you like and enjoy shooting, that way it will hopefully encourage you to practice and practice lots, because the stopping power of a missed shot is nothing.

Originally Posted by Hutch

They were turkey hunting and it was bird shot. He still has 37 pellets in his body. If it was deer slugs he wouldn't be around.

All calibres have pros and cons, there is no best calibre if there was there would only be one.

Why would either of those be?

Originally Posted by Hutch

They were turkey hunting and it was bird shot. He still has 37 pellets in his body. If it was deer slugs he wouldn't be around.

As Casey Stengel.... or was it Yogi Berra said,"I stands corrected." It had been a long time since I read of it. You're right about LeMond's accident. I confused it with another that i read of or perhaps heard about on NPR some years ago where a fellow got shot in the stomach with a deer slug and lived. I googled the term and can't find the incident but I did hear of it. Maybe one for Ripley's.

Originally Posted by singlewedge

After a couple of years of research I have decided on a 9mm. A 9mm HydroShock will stop an individual as well as a 40 or 45 but without the kick and gaping wound cavity. I guess I should say that my objective is to incapacitate rather than kill. Its just easier on the karma. If I need to kill I have the option but incapacitate first.

Anyway here are the choices.

Glock 19

Springfield XD9

If you have pros and cons let me know.

Help on your choices:

First of all, shoot the ones listed above and then more if you have some friends around or a range with rentals. Pick the one that you can hit with consistently & what feels more comfortable. Second, do your research on reliability. I assume that you plan on carrying this pistol concealed, so a medium or small frame is what you will be after. The 9mm, .40, & .45acp all have their ups and downs. Key is hitting your target with every round. This is the ONLY form of Gun Control that ANYONE should believe in, bad guys will always have guns. I'm personally a .45acp fan with my 1911 that has all the bells and whistles, but for a box stock handgun, the glock is hard to beat. It is freakish at how reliable it is & they are quite accurate out of the box. I highly recommend recommend night sights, tritium. I have three safes full of firearms & my recent purchase was a Glock 26 (some call it the "Baby Glock") for my wife. This little rascal is super accurate, enough so that I am wanting one for myself, just in .357 sig or .40. It's got the factory night sights, Pierce Grip Extension (place for the pinky to rest), extended slide release & extended magazine release. I will not put an extended magazine release on mine, but her hand is small and the extra 1/8" or so helps her with magazine changes.

Whatever you get, practice, practice, practice...from the carrying position.

Time is short, near bedtime. I haven't read all 12 pages so if this has been mentioned please forgive. I voted other. If carry is a concern and over penetration is a concern, you might consider a Makarov. Good conceal gun that won't over penetrate. These can be had, really good ones, for half the price of the two choices you have listed.

I have a Makarov but I prefer my Tokarev. Excellent penetration. However, I'll carry either. Carrying any gun is better than not carrying any.

I'd go with the Springfield XD, I'm not a big Glock fan...
FWIW, ONe of the Jacksonville Jaquars was shot 14 times, and hit 14 times with 9mm.
He lived...He's paralyzed, but he lived....Now, Football players are pretty big, but still.
I think I also told the story of my friend, He was in a shoot out, He got hit 2x with a 9mm, now he almost died, he hit two guys, one of them got back up and shot him. He said, he'll never own another 9mm....
Now, I have several, One for concealed carry, A Kel Tec...The other's are too big,
I have a Beretta 92FS which I love, It's got such smooth action, wide ejection port, double stack mag, All metal, no plastic, great weapon....

All in All 9's are great weapons, and really, How often are you going to be in a situation where you'll need to use it...

P.S. If you can find any, Winchester Ranger Ammo...Awesome, IMHO, I think it's better than Hydrashock's....

I would go with the SA for sure and if you can swing it the XDM. The XDM just feels better in my hand then any glock, and known for better accuracy. The XDM comes with a match grade barrel.