Thread: Respect vs. Blasphemy

Originally Posted by xman

All I'm saying is thebigspender is surely correct in his assessment.
Further corroborating evidence can be found within the US prison system.


The US has an atheist population of roughly 15%, but only 0.2% of inmates are atheist.
I fully expect this will also be dismissed.

Check out this data!


So, according to the correlation theories that are implied here, if someone is black, and a Catholic or Protestant it is more than likely that they are a criminal, or soon will be....

Originally Posted by hoglahoo

As far as respect given by government, I don't think it should extend to protecting religious people against whatever they choose to call blasphemy

It should rather exist to protect the God-given rights of all the people. The "right" to not be offended is not one of them

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I answered the poll on a more personal note though. As far as respect itself, I'm willing to respect a religious system of belief based on truth, but I'm not willing to respect a religious system of belief based on anything else. Therefore whatever I hold to be true is what I will respect. I'll also respect the right of anyone and everyone to believe or not believe whatever they choose, and I'll (try to ) respect people themselves independently of their religious affiliations until or unless they show me they're not worthy of respect

But since my religion is right, and my religion says the other religions are wrong, then I'll respect mine but not others. I'm surprised I'm the only one who voted this way so far, especially considering other remarks I've been reading in the so-called Jesus threads

Very honest.

My preferred option wasn't there. So I didn't vote. I respect all religions (So far) in at least certain aspects.....but not as a whole (except for mine). And even then I'm differing between a religion and the organisations and people that carry it out.

I have respect for my religion....but I don't always agree with or am happy about the way the church I'm a member of is run.

Originally Posted by Seraphim

Check out this data!


So, according to the correlation theories that are implied here, if someone is black, and a Catholic or Protestant it is more than likely that they are a criminal, or soon will be....

Unfortunately, this is true, but it's a loaded statistic. It's because the vast majority of the black population is Catholic that you see this happening. More unfortunately, the majority of prison inmates are black and below a certain poverty line.

I don't think religion as it relates to prison inmates is relevant. It's simply a case of if a = b, and b = c, then a must = c.

Originally Posted by Oglethorpe

Unfortunately, this is true, but it's a loaded statistic. It's because the vast majority of the black population is Catholic that you see this happening. More unfortunately, the majority of prison inmates are black and below a certain poverty line.

I don't think religion as it relates to prison inmates is relevant. It's simply a case of if a = b, and b = c, then a must = c.

WHAT?

Are you dismissing the data? Isn't it clear as day? Religion=violence, black=violence.

Xman has clearly shown that in both the global scale (vis a vis the GPI) that religion is strongly associated with violence. As well as on the local scale (prison population data).

I have also shown the same correlations in regards to race and violence by using the same metrics both globally and locally.


Poverty is just a societal crutch people will use to cloud the data!

So i should not trust black catholics?

Phew...All this time i was avoiding all catholics.

Originally Posted by Slartibartfast

So i should not trust black catholics?

Phew...All this time i was avoiding all catholics.

Black atheists are perhaps the ones to watch out for, as they could "go bad" at the drop of a hat....It's a 50/50 split on those guys.

Originally Posted by Seraphim

WHAT?

Are you dismissing the data? Isn't it clear as day? Religion=violence, black=violence.

Xman has clearly shown that in both the global scale (vis a vis the GPI) that religion is strongly associated with violence. As well as on the local scale (prison population data).

I have also shown the same correlations in regards to race and violence by using the same metrics both globally and locally.


Poverty is just a societal crutch people will use to cloud the data!

I think it was an interesting point that X made on an international level, because there are more variables than just poverty: a main one being religious links to government. However, I'm contending that as applied to our own country and its criminal population, it doesn't hold water. So, in this respect, I'm saying yes, we need to dismiss the data.

Originally Posted by Slartibartfast

So i should not trust black catholics?

Phew...All this time i was avoiding all catholics.

Could've fooled me!

Originally Posted by Oglethorpe

I think it was an interesting point that X made on an international level, because there are more variables than just poverty: a main one being religious links to government. However, I'm contending that as applied to our own country and its criminal population, it doesn't hold water. So, in this respect, I'm saying yes, we need to dismiss the data.

I believe that the international data is just as contrived, and does not look at many of the other factors.

If you look at the data I had in post #33 you will see a very tight correlation between global income level and "peace index" values. Really, take a close look at that map, it corelates extremely well. Chile, Austarlia, New Zealand, UAE, Kuwait.

X's Youtube link cherry picked data it wanted to present. Greece, Italy, Ireland, Spain are all extremely Christian countries, and rated as high, or very high on the GPI. But that doesn't go very well with the ominous techno music pulsing in the background, so they left it off.

The same is true of prison populations. Yes there is a large number of blacks in prison, but are they in prison because they are black (or Catholic, Protestant, whatever...), or because as black people in America, they unfortunately often have less opportunities for financial success, and often are placed in positions of desparation?

Originally Posted by Seraphim

I believe that the international data is just as contrived, and does not look at many of the other factors.

If you look at the data I had in post #33 you will see a very tight correlation between global income level and "peace index" values. Really, take a close look at that map, it corelates extremely well. Chile, Austarlia, New Zealand, UAE, Kuwait.

X's Youtube link cherry picked data it wanted to present. Greece, Italy, Ireland, Spain are all extremely Christian countries, and rated as high, or very high on the GPI. But that doesn't go very well with the ominous techno music pulsing in the background, so they left it off.

The same is true of prison populations. Yes there is a large number of blacks in prison, but are they in prison because they are black (or Catholic, Protestant, whatever...), or because as black people in America, they unfortunately often have less opportunities for financial success, and often are placed in positions of desparation?

I'm with you on the prison stats. That is an isolated statistic that can be broken out with pretty specific granularity. We can safely say that the racial/poverty stats are the drivers on those demographics, and as such, the religious demographics are just the backgrounds of the poor/black.

The international stats are not as cut and dry, and I would agree that they are not conclusive by any stretch, but there is some validity to the claim, specifically in the middle east. However, on the flip side, you could make a solid argument that the war-torn parts of Africa are not particularly the way they are because of religion.

I will agree that unfortunately statistics can be twisted any way the interpreter chooses, which is why I'm glad you've exercised due diligence in pulling in a bunch of different sets.

Originally Posted by Seraphim

The same is true of prison populations. Yes there is a large number of blacks in prison, but are they in prison because they are black (or Catholic, Protestant, whatever...), or because as black people in America, they unfortunately often have less opportunities for financial success, and often are placed in positions of desparation?

I think it is largely class rather than race that inclines a young man or women to go one way or the other. For young black men living in the inner cities with unemployment well above the national average, no role models save pimps and drug pushers it is not hard to see why they would turn to crime. Latinos and blacks also have the gang phenomenon.

Not long ago I saw a special on P.O.V. on the Crips and the Bloods. They interviewed some of the original members of both gangs circa 1950s. In those days they met on the streets and fought with their fists and maybe a chain, baseball bat or a knife.

Now as we know it is drive by shootings with fully automatic weapons. That is progress I guess. In terms of violence we Americans have nothing on Caucasians in the former Czech republic. Have you ever read of the violence perpetuated on the inmates of the Russian prisons by their guards ? Look at the torture that Chileans endured in the Pinochet years .... I always wondered where they found people who would do that to other people. Rwanda and Darfur baffle the mind. After the holocaust we heard "Never Again" and then came Cambodia and Pol Pot.

When the Sopranos is a TV show that is one of the most popular and highly regarded in television history doesn't that say something about the human condition ? We don't attend public executions anymore but we laugh when the guys in Pulp Fiction blow peoples brains all over the interior of an automobile.

When we watch pro hockey hoping for a fist fight and all the better if they use sticks to beat each others brains out or we hope for the crashes in the NASCAR races. If a civilization can be judged by its art we homo sapians must be prone to violence regardless of race, creed or color.