Thread: I can't use my straight at college!

Originally Posted by jcw122

I found the actual Weapons Policy on the PSU website actually. It is extremely blurry with regards to the definition of knives:

Any knife with a blade larger than that of a folding pocket knife; dagger; razor or other cutting instrument, the blade of which is exposed in an automatic way by switch, push-button, spring mechanism, or otherwise.

It does say "razor" but that is only something with a switch/button/etc. Additionally, saying "larger than that of a folding pocket knife" is pretty broad, as folding knife blades can be pretty big or pretty small.

I'm not a lawyer, but I am a published writer so I have a pretty good grasp of English usage. Based on this, this policy can be broken down in the following way.

The blade length exemption applies only to knives not to razors or other cutting instruments.

Daggers, which are a type of knife, are excluded from the blade length exemption. There is no definition of a dagger, but by common usage a dagger is a double edged blade used for stabbing or thrusting.

Razors or other cutting instruments are only banned if they open in an automatic way by switch, pushbotton, spring mechanism or otherwise. This is a common definition of a switch blade knife found in many knife laws.

To me this means.

Any single edge folding pocket knife is allowed so if it is a knife that folds and fits into your pocket its okay.

Any fixed blade single edged knife is allowed as long as the blade is no longer than the blade of the largest folding knife that will fit into your pocket.

Double edge blades are forbidden, whether folding or fixed.

Razors are okay as long as they do not open automatically. There is one possible problem here if you can open the razor by either gravity or motion as this could be construed as falling into the otherwise catagory (this is how ballisong knives are restricted as switchblades in many states).

Again, I'm not a lawyer, this is all based on common sense.

Huzzah!

Razors are okay as long as they do not open automatically. There is one possible problem here if you can open the razor by either gravity or motion...

Another good reason to keep your pivots tight.

Originally Posted by jcw

Success!!!!!! Case solved!!! I emailed the University Police last night and I got a reply today saying that they saw no reason I should not be able to use it to shave!!!

You might want to make a hard copy of that reply and put it with your razors just in case.

Originally Posted by 'English

Welcome to 2009 and get real. Use your brain in future and if you want to feel ****ed that's OK. But your mother was correct and sharp tools at University are a stupid idea. You know this already so don't try looking for a sympathy vote.

Jeez, I'm getting old. I remember when me, my roommate and the RA would, on a regular basis, throw our pistols into our bookbags and spend the evening at the university-sponsored ($1.50/hr), on-campus shooting range.


Things were better then, why I remember when we used to .... [long, boring reminiscences deleted].
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I am a lawyer, and the word in the rule that has me concerned is "otherwise". It usually means something like "in ways different from those listed", rather than in was "similar to those listed". A lawyer can also only give you a best guess. It will be the judge, or dean of students, or some other university official, who will be the "judge" of what is permitted. My own view is that anything can be used as a deadly weapon, even a shoelace, so, there it is illogical to ban a useful (and traditional) tool that happens to be sharp. I'm sure the school cafeterias have knives that can inflict as serious injury on others, but the knives are allowed. I would not rely on the police officer's opinion, because a second police officer who might respond to any investigation may have a differing view. Try to get it approved by the big cheese there. Good luck,
RalphS

Originally Posted by RalphS

I am a lawyer, and the word in the rule that has me concerned is "otherwise". It usually means something like "in ways different from those listed", rather than in was "similar to those listed". A lawyer can also only give you a best guess. It will be the judge, or dean of students, or some other university official, who will be the "judge" of what is permitted. My own view is that anything can be used as a deadly weapon, even a shoelace, so, there it is illogical to ban a useful (and traditional) tool that happens to be sharp. I'm sure the school cafeterias have knives that can inflict as serious injury on others, but the knives are allowed. I would not rely on the police officer's opinion, because a second police officer who might respond to any investigation may have a differing view. Try to get it approved by the big cheese there. Good luck,
RalphS

Well, I don't think I'm going to take it that far. I think I'm just going to lay low, and keep to myself about it once I have it there. And if anyone gives me a hard time, I'll just say the University Police OKed it. I really doubt anyone will be concerned, my RA is cool with everything. I mean it would be nice getting a higher form of approval, but I don't think I want to push my luck currently, haha. When I sent the email, it was forwarded to the correct person, as he stated that my email was forwarded to him. But thanks for the good points. There was a line in the Weapons policy citing anything that can cause serious bodily harm, but like you mentioned, that could be a chair or a cafeteria knife.

Here is the full policy: Weapons Policy

Here is what he specifically said: "While this is a bit outside what the policy anticipated, I see no reason why you couldn't use it to shave."

Originally Posted by DavidM

Why the hell did you ask??? I would have waited until someone had a problem.

just remember its always easier to ask forgiveness than permission


-dan-

Originally Posted by jcw122

Well, I don't think I'm going to take it that far. I think I'm just going to lay low, and keep to myself about it once I have it there. And if anyone gives me a hard time, I'll just say the University Police OKed it. I really doubt anyone will be concerned, my RA is cool with everything. . . .

Here is the full policy: Weapons Policy

Here is what he specifically said: "While this is a bit outside what the policy anticipated, I see no reason why you couldn't use it to shave."

Well, since the referenced Weapons policy expressly provides:

"Any questions concerning the interpretations of these regulations should be forwarded to University Police"

and you've done so, I think you are on better grounds if anyone at the University wants to make an issue of it. SAVE THE E-MAIL THOUGH!!

RalphS

Originally Posted by RalphS

Well, since the referenced Weapons policy expressly provides:

"Any questions concerning the interpretations of these regulations should be forwarded to University Police"

and you've done so, I think you are on better grounds if anyone at the University wants to make an issue of it. SAVE THE E-MAIL THOUGH!!

RalphS

Will do! Thanks RaphS.

I just enjoyed my first straight shave BTW It was a lil scary, but pretty cool!

Originally Posted by RalphS

Well, since the referenced Weapons policy expressly provides:

"Any questions concerning the interpretations of these regulations should be forwarded to University Police"

and you've done so, I think you are on better grounds if anyone at the University wants to make an issue of it. SAVE THE E-MAIL THOUGH!!

RalphS

I am not a lawyer like Ralph, but this is a good idea in general. Save ALL communications (email or otherwise) you ever have with anyone regarding anything that has to do with work, school, finances, or other important things.



In my last job (software engineer) I did this, and 10 years worth of email without attachments is still only 12 MB. And it saved my ass 2 or 3 times. Nothing ends an argument so quickly as the customer reading his own writings

And I am doing it again in my current job. Though now I do it mostly for the ability to look something up, and to have a timeline of events with data. I work for a pharmaceutical company, and for us it often necessary to be able to tell afterwards what happened when etc. We do have official logbooks for this, but those don't capture communications; only event and actions.

Originally Posted by RalphS

I am a lawyer, and the word in the rule that has me concerned is "otherwise". It usually means something like "in ways different from those listed",

Yes, but "otherwise" is describing automatic ways of exposing the blade. The "otherwise" might be used to include something like balisong or butterfly knives in the ban.

I went to Barber College. Straight razors were encouraged.