Thread: Shapton 16k, mixed grit??

Other than being thicker, it appears like the same system as the "Glass". Heck, I only hone for myself and its doubtful that I will ever wear these out.

Heads up, the 30k is not worth it as few...very few razors can handle that fine of an edge.

Originally Posted by ScottGoodman

I have been a huge fan of the Shapton glass stones for quite some time and I will say that it is the most precise system available on the market...but not that many honers can get the best of them. They are very fast and you can easily overhone on 16k, the stones have excellent feedback. My personal favorite is a progression from 2,4,8,16k followed by thuringian. A very sharp, but smooth edge.

1) The 16k stone is not a 16k stone. It's not a matter of overhoning. One pass on the 16k creates scratches way coarser than 16.000 grit. See the video by drmat on youtube.

2)Many websites sell the 10.000 grit stone at a higher price than the 16.000 grit.

3)Quite a few websites have listed that the shapton 16k stone is made of mixed grit. From I think 2000 to 16000 grit particles.

4)The 16k stone is not recommended for razors.
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If people love the 16k stone, that's great. The point is that is not a 16k stone.

Originally Posted by SharpMan

1) The 16k stone is not a 16k stone. It's not a matter of overhoning. One pass on the 16k creates scratches way coarser than 16.000 grit.

If people love the 16k stone, that's great. The point is that is not a 16k stone.

Mine is a 16k Grit hone
It doesn't produce scratches just a mirror bevel
I have honed more razors with mine than anyone else in the world using it as a final finish and before the 30k


Now if you want to say some of the newer 16k Shapton GS might have an issue, then fine go for it. The 4k Norton's had issues for a few years

But you have ZERO proof all 16k Shaptons are dual grit, mine doesn't have that issue and it seems Scott's has no issues either, there are quite a few other honers on our FB page and on TSD that have no issues with their 16k either

So there ya go

I bought mine in 2008 or 2009

Originally Posted by gssixgun

Mine is a 16k Grit hone
It doesn't produce scratches just a mirror bevel
I have honed more razors with mine than anyone else in the world using it as a final finish and before the 30k


Now if you want to say some of the newer 16k Shapton GS might have an issue, then fine go for it. The 4k Norton's had issues for a few years

But you have ZERO proof all 16k Shaptons are dual grit, mine doesn't have that issue and it seems Scott's has no issues either, there are quite a few other honers on our FB page and on TSD that have no issues with their 16k either

So there ya go

I bought mine in 2008 or 2009

1)First of all this is not an issue. Many websites had clearly indicated that the 16000 grit stone was mixed grit. So it's not an error that was made on a few stones. When I ''reported'' on this matter a few years back showing that the site dictum.de(a very well respected company in Germany) had included the mixed grit info, the response here was quite comical like '' must be incorrect translation''.
2)Many websites had/have the 16000 at a lower price than the 10000 grit. That's suspicious right?
3)There are high magnification pictures showing the 16k giving coarser scratches than a 8.000 grit stone.

If anybody has a high resolution magnification picture of the bevel when going from lets say a fine(8 to 12k) stone to the 16.000 which shows a better scratch pattern, please post it. I start getting a mirrory finish around 3-4000 grit. If the shapton 16k is mixed grit consisting of 6 to 16k grit, then it is possible that one might get a mirror like finish, BUT when magnified it will also have coarser scratches.

Originally Posted by SharpMan

1) The 16k stone is not a 16k stone. It's not a matter of overhoning. One pass on the 16k creates scratches way coarser than 16.000 grit. See the video by drmat on youtube.

2)Many websites sell the 10.000 grit stone at a higher price than the 16.000 grit.

3)Quite a few websites have listed that the shapton 16k stone is made of mixed grit. From I think 2000 to 16000 grit particles.

4)The 16k stone is not recommended for razors.
========================================

If people love the 16k stone, that's great. The point is that is not a 16k stone.

Another armchair honer that can only state what they have read when they really don't KNOW what they are talking about.

And by the way, we have looked at the scratches in VERY high tech scopes. Specifically Dr. Ron's equipment at Charlie's annual meets.

Originally Posted by SharpMan

1)First of all this is not an issue. Many websites had clearly indicated that the 16000 grit stone was mixed grit. So it's not an error that was made on a few stones. When I ''reported'' on this matter a few years back showing that the site dictum.de(a very well respected company in Germany) had included the mixed grit info, the response here was quite comical like '' must be incorrect translation''.
2)Many websites had/have the 16000 at a lower price than the 10000 grit. That's suspicious right?
3)There are high magnification pictures showing the 16k giving coarser scratches than a 8.000 grit stone.

If anybody has a high resolution magnification picture of the bevel when going from lets say a fine(8 to 12k) stone to the 16.000 which shows a better scratch pattern, please post it. I start getting a mirrory finish around 3-4000 grit. If the shapton 16k is mixed grit consisting of 6 to 16k grit, then it is possible that one might get a mirror like finish, BUT when magnified it will also have coarser scratches.

How many Different straight razors have you honed with your 16k Shapton ???
How many Different 16k Shaptons have you tested ???

Please let us know

Originally Posted by ScottGoodman

Another armchair honer that can only state what they have read when they really don't KNOW what they are talking about.

I think you are on to something

Originally Posted by ScottGoodman

Another armchair honer that can only state what they have read when they really don't KNOW what they are talking about.

This is a very strong argument, bravo. Obviously I'm being sarcastic cause it's actually quite a dumb statement. I'll tell you why:
- If not just one, but quite a few websites on the product page of the Shapton 16.000 grit stated that the stone is made of mixed grit, from 6k to 16k, then a consumer should use that information to judge whether to buy or not to buy the stone.
- If the Shapton 16.000 grit is cheaper than the 10.000 grit, clue number 2.
- There have been complaints of quite some users that the Shapton 16k gives coarser scratches and there are pictures that show this very clearly. Pictures on the internet that we can look up ourselves. Even a video by drmatt.

Now the question is not whether I can convince you or you can convince me. I started this because I wanted to inform potential buyers about this stone. Based on the information I have seen(information on the product page of different websellers, a lower price than a lower grit, the feedback from some users and pictures of the edge) I would definitely not recommend this stone.

Shapton glass 8k
https://i0.wp.com/i765.photobucket.c...85-8Kglass.jpg

vs

Shapton glass 16k:


https://i0.wp.com/i765.photobucket.c...0strokes-2.jpg

DrMatts video, from 6:00 the comparison with the naniwa 12k.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sn10...nnel=DrMatt357

A razor finished on 0.5 micron compound is already perfect or as I like to call it 9/10 broke.
All that video shows is a "decent" edge at 10 passes being destroyed by overhoning.
Why anyone would do more than 10 strokes on a 16k GS is beyond me.
The scratches in the bevel are cosmetic & irrelevant to the edge or it would have chipped the edge before 10 passes.

That the Naniwa was less destructive shows that it is a softer slower stone. Comparing the 12k Naniwa to something like a gentle coticule would reproduce the results. You could probably do 400 passes on some coticules with no damage where the Naniwa would likely destroy the edge after about 100 passes. Apples & oranges.