Thread: Big trouble with Naniwa Superstones 10000 and 12000

Lemur,

concerning the USB microscope:

Originally Posted by Lemur

Please do, always nice to see how people have solved different things.

OK, fine. I'll do that. But I'll put it in another thread then. And please do give me a little more time... I'd first like to sort this here out.

Originally Posted by Lemur

... You do know that if you finally do find the culprit and don't post about it, you will be condemned for eternity!

Yes, sure. Although I am not sure if I will succeed.

Currently it looks quite good. I strongly rubbed the utility knife blade over the ATOMA, thorougly washed and brushed it, then lapped the 12k again. After that, used the Nagura on the 12k ( good idea / bad idea? ) and again lots of water. It seems to behave now. Started to build the bevel...

DDTech,

Having followed your thread closely I have to wounder, is the nagura you are using a Japanese natural nagura or a synthetic material? A natural could have so called "toxic", low grit, inclusions. A synthetic is likely not finishing grit material, but a 600 - 1000 grit rubbing stone meant for cleaning hones.

Either way the nagura could be the source of contamination if you are still having trouble.

Jonathan

Jonathan,

Originally Posted by Datsots

Having followed your thread closely I have to wounder, is the nagura you are using a Japanese natural nagura or a synthetic material? A natural could have so called "toxic", low grit, inclusions. A synthetic is likely not finishing grit material, but a 600 - 1000 grit rubbing stone meant for cleaning hones.

Either way the nagura could be the source of contamination if you are still having trouble.

Thanks for the hint. Got it together with the naniwas and think it is synthetic.

As to me this also was an unknown factor, I abandoned it first place together with the sandpaper. Since that did not change anything I started reusing it now.

Frank

As you are finding these spots in the stone even after lapping I'm starting to think if they offer a new stone take it. It was odd both 10 & 12 k were similar.

Oz,

Originally Posted by onimaru55

As you are finding these spots in the stone even after lapping I'm starting to think if they offer a new stone take it. It was odd both 10 & 12 k were similar.

All this thread, except the intro and the first two images, is with the 12k. I had the issue first with the 10k, that's why the additional 12k came and all this started. As this all got rolling I was busy enough with the 12k. So I truely can't say if all this counts for the 10k also.

After all this, getting a new stone would be interesting, just to see, if mine is an exception or the rule.

Neil, Oz,

Originally Posted by Neil Miller

... You also mentioned how long it is taking you to hone the razor - that seems way too long to me, and usually represents the extra work that a problem blade gives rise to (eg one with a warp/kink in the spine). In any event, the 10k and 12k hones you have do not require an excessive amount of laps: personally I got best results around 20 - 30 laps, but some people say they do 50 - 60 (which would be excessive for me)....

Originally Posted by onimaru55

OK. Taking your time is fine if you're new but how many strokes might you be doing? ...

OK, let's get through this step by step. And in order to come to the point. This one is with good ending.

First I re-set the bevel. For that I started with the ATOMA 400 (yes). Almost broke my heart when I first layed the blade on it and, as Neil already mentioned, feels truely freaky. On this I did x-strokes only with lots of water and no pressure. After a while the feeling gets a bit smoother. The result is still scary.





Some where asking if I am not "nose picking" (do You say so?) with watching these chips under 200+ power magnification. Doing 30, 40, 50 strokes on that plate and still having leftovers, I realized how bad the damage actually was.

I still did not feel to well with the plate and then continued on my 800 grit stone. There was still a good amount of work to do on the 800. Even now there are some remainders that became more apparent on the higher levels of progression.

With 800 it she cuts (thin) hair from my arm. I finished like that:


800 with 50 power:



Switched to the 3k stone and did two times 40 circles followed by 30 x-strokes. I go heel forward and due to the round tip and toe, I do a bit of rolling and whiping. No specific pressure.



followed by another 25 x-strokes:




Concerning pressure: I never have the problem, that my stone wants to wander over the table, even with wet surface. I do not tighten the screws of the holder and sometimes pick the stone up and do strokes having the stone on my open palm with a little guidance left and right (caution: finger tips).

Then switched to 5k. two times 40 circles (per direction) followed by 30 x-strokes:



begins to shine. 30 more x-strokes:


50 power


and another 25 x-strokes

[.... hmm image upload fails. is there a quota or a technical problem.... try to post and continue editing....]

... continued. The other post did not accept more images. See if it works now.

We are at 5k with 2x 40 circles + 30 x-strokes + 30 x-strokes and another 25 x-strokes



Now as the edge flattens out, remainders of the former chips become more and more apparent. Also the edge still looks a little "noisy". That to some extent is true and to some extent result of the lighting and focus, as we are watching the bevel with a slight angle and not directly from top.

At that point, I normally would go back to 3k, maybe even 800 to enhance that. Here I went on, in order to see how far I could get.

But it is willingly picking up hair when flying over the arm.

After the 5k I stropped the razor and went to the 8k. Getting a bit more careful. Did 40 circles, checked - fine, then 15 x-strokes



This is what I mean. Not as nice, as I'd like to have it, but compared to what I had before....






Then another 15 x-strokes and stropping. Now at some parts a tiny burr appears. Isn't that the "holy burr", that does the shaving?






Now. 12k. Needless to say that I was holding my breath and did sloooow mooooaaatiiiioooonnnnn. 5 x-strokes first, then thorough checking - passed. 7 more x-strokes. Checking... maybe a minor issue, but I can't tell for sure.



rest is fine.


I did not want to overly stress my luck, but I then did a final five x-strokes (without breathing).




Then I stropped it, stropped it on a balsa board with cr-ox and stropped it again, then went to bed.

So, I got it finished - at last. Still not overly happy. The edge is not as it could be and I found no culprit. Have I been lucky this time or am I over it? A bit of a bad taste remains.

So much for "nose picking". Forget the microscope and go shaving....

How was the shave?
After a few hours of sleep I took a shower, stropped the razor and let it "fly" over my abdomen. Hairs exploding in all directions without even trying to resist - wow!
The shave was marvelous. Literally like a warm knife through warm butter. I did a second pass, but over my lip as well as parts of the sides I did not get a single "kr". Did barely feel the blade at all. Absolutely no irritation. Will have a red face, when I continue to touch it all day with my dirty sweaty fingers

After the shave I switched on the microscope again. No noticable change. Burr still there waiting for its next mission.


Frank





No idea how to get rid of this image:

All is well that ends well as in a good shave. I think the term you are looking for in English is "nitpicking" Nitpicking (pastime) - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia . I did learn one thing following along with this tread, a usb microscope is off the must have list. I got enough to worry about without that too.

Bob

LOOONG thread,great pics,In the end you got a great shave,thats all that matters.
To be honest when I started using a 100 power scope,honeing lost the fun factor,I saw things that were of no import to the final goal of a good shave.

I love a happy ending. *snif*