Thread: ONE COTICULE HONING

Originally Posted by gary haywood

Bart i'm just trying method when you say shave arm hair i can get razor to only just shave arm hair and leg hair is that ok. ?I've just finished last stage and it easily shaves arm hair.

Yes, depending a bit on the Coticule, after step3 the arm (or leg) shaving ability is often not a "wiping hairs off" experience. Thats ok. Step4, the last one before the tape, will improve it a bit, but I generally don't even check at that point.

I'm looking forward to your hear your results.

Bart.

Originally Posted by Bart

The method that I presented does not rely on fast stroking speed. In the video you saw, I was using the regular X-stroke. In the suggested method, the bevel is set by performing back and forth strokes with a minor pressure. It goes considerably faster, and it can also be performed much faster, without a lot of practice. When the hard work is done, the required regular X-stroke does not demand so many laps that it will take much time.

Bart.

I didn't mean to suggest that this method relies on fast strokes, I meant more to suggest that you may be able to hone razors in 15 minutes using this method because you hone insanely fast, but also because you've done this method dozens more times than any of us. But mostly to point out your crazy honing skillz

Originally Posted by hi_bud_gl

I have to show this and hope this helps a little more .
your picture after setting bevel adding 1 layers of tape will not do what you have shown on picture 3 and 4 but it will most likely will do process is shown below.i will attach picture.
I will answer all the questions which members asks from me but i am sure there is a lot more unhappy members will respond this. That is why i will wait a little longer.

this is what is i think and nothing else just to help each other and rest. I don't mean to disrespect to you or your ideas i just think it is wrong .

What I'm trying to illustrate with my drawing, is this:


Right of the slurry, the edge it not at very high keenness. It shaves but not very well.
Keeness is defined by the width of the line where both bevel faces meet each other.

After the slurry this line (the very tip of the bevel) still needs further refinement for better shaving performance.
If the spine is taped at that point, the honing angle becomes a bit steeper, and the hone will only affect the very tip of the razor. While honing with this new angle, the secondary bevel will grow from the very tip down. That's one thing I wanted to illustrate with the drawing. At the same time, the maximum refinement will be achieved gradually. If 3 layers of tape were applied, it would go faster and the new, secondary bevel would hit its limit sooner, hence with a narrower secondary bevel. That's something I also tried to reflect in the explanation that came with the drawing. I chose for one layer of tape, because it is a generally accepted honing technique, and because I got better results allowing the secondary bevel growing a bit wider. I believe this way the Coticule with water can sneak slowly up to its maximum keenness level.


[drawing by hi_bud_gl, in a previous post]

Once the edge has reached its finest limit on the hone in use, it indeed would start to move backwards, making the entire blade microscopically narrower. If I read it correctly, this is what your drawing shows, and actually mine too, is you compare the height of the red peak with that of the green peak. This is normal for all honing, unless you could manage to stop at the exact stroke when the edge hits its maximum keenness level.

Best regards,
Bart.

Bart,

I read your post from start to finish right
after your posted it, but I've been waiting
to reply since I wanted to put some more
thought into what I was going to say.

First off, thank you for all of the thought-
ful advice you've been providing to this
community for a long time. It's very much
appreciated.

Secondly, I think that experimentation
with hones and different approaches like
what you've described is just about the
coolest thing about SRP and straight razor
shaving. There are just so many different
techniques that people can choose from to
have the best shave of their life and keep
a razor sharp indefinitely.

Like Lynn said, this is so much fun!

Thanks again,

- Scott

Originally Posted by sebell

I think that experimentation
with hones and different approaches like
what you've described is just about the
coolest thing about SRP and straight razor
shaving. There are just so many different
techniques that people can choose from to
have the best shave of their life and keep
a razor sharp indefinitely.

Like Lynn said, this is so much fun!

Scott, thanks,
that is exactly my sentiment.

I surely won't be sticking exclusively to this honing paradigm. There's too much fun in trying all kinds of different approaches.

Bart.

Ok i think i am tired of this and we are not understand each other.What you have said means? please explain if my understanding is wrong?
by adding 1 layer of the tape you are getting sharper edge then without tape?

and
adding 3 layers of tape will make it more sharper? you will have better angle and blade will be sharper?
are you trying to say that?
thank you

People i am not fighting with Bart and you don't have to protect him.
This is thinking (idea) differences and we are trying to resolve it . i hope we are not children.


QUOTE=Bart;371368]What I'm trying to illustrate with my drawing, is this:


Right of the slurry, the edge it not at very high keenness. It shaves but not very well.
Keeness is defined by the width of the line where both bevel faces meet each other.

After the slurry this line (the very tip of the bevel) still needs further refinement for better shaving performance.
If the spine is taped at that point, the honing angle becomes a bit steeper, and the hone will only affect the very tip of the razor. While honing with this new angle, the secondary bevel will grow from the very tip down. That's one thing I wanted to illustrate with the drawing. At the same time, the maximum refinement will be achieved gradually. If 3 layers of tape were applied, it would go faster and the new, secondary bevel would hit its limit sooner, hence with a narrower secondary bevel. That's something I also tried to reflect in the explanation that came with the drawing. I chose for one layer of tape, because it is a generally accepted honing technique, and because I got better results allowing the secondary bevel growing a bit wider. I believe this way the Coticule with water can sneak slowly up to its maximum keenness level.


[drawing by hi_bud_gl, in a previous post]

Once the edge has reached its finest limit on the hone in use, it indeed would start to move backwards, making the entire blade microscopically narrower. If I read it correctly, this is what your drawing shows, and actually mine too, is you compare the height of the red peak with that of the green peak. This is normal for all honing, unless you could manage to stop at the exact stroke when the edge hits its maximum keenness level.

Best regards,
Bart.[/QUOTE]

Originally Posted by hi_bud_gl

Ok i think i am tired of this and we are not understand each other.What you have said means? please explain if my understanding is wrong?
by adding 1 layer of the tape you are getting sharper edge then without tape?

Yes and no. It's not the tape as such. Have you ever used sandpaper to round the sharp edge of a piece of wood? Noticed how the sanding goes very quickly in the beginning but gradually slows down as the surface to be sanded grows? You can chamfer a hard edge with 600 grit sandpaper rapidly, but it would take forever to sand down one 100 grit scratch in a larger surface.
I'm using this exact principle on razors. By adding the tape, I divert all abrasion to the very tip of the bevel. The Coticule with water, that is normally only able to very slowly polish already sharp edges, now is able to actually refine the tip and make the edge keener.

and
adding 3 layers of tape will make it more sharper? you will have better angle and blade will be sharper?
are you trying to say that?

No, adding 3 layers just diverts the abrasion to the very tip in a more "agressive" way. It would take even less work before the maximum keenness was reached with a narrower secondary bevel as result, but at the cost of an obtuser edge. I also think it's better to allow the Coticule to go slower. I like my method with only one additonal layer best. (I have tried with 3 and 2 also).

thank you

People i am not fighting with Bart and you don't have to protect him.
I should hope not.
This is thinking (idea) differences and we are trying to resolve it . i hope we are not children.

Like I said earlier, I respect your straight criticism. I have not the slightest problem discussing these things with an open mind.
Of course it's possible that we might have to agree to disagree on this one.

The sad thing on this whole SRP community is, that one can't join in the pub and grab a beer together, after ending a good discussion. I would gladly pay for that extra functionality. (eh, wrong thread, I guess...)

Best regards,
Bart.

i was hoping will get answer yes or no not both?
Now when you round sharp edge of the wood sandpaper does work faster and then slows but not because of the surface of the wood because sandpaper looses it is quality.
I will stop in here .
Again was a good discussion lets give people chance and let them try your method and come back leave feedback . I hope i am wrong .

respectfully
Sham

If i wanted to refresh would i do it with one layer of tape and coti with just water. If this did'nt work. would i drop back to no tape and light slurry honing then add tape and 50 laps plain water.

The only other thing is i have a thew razors i have to roll i would find this difficult with back and forth strokes