Thread: Measles

Originally Posted by ScoutHikerDad

Since Phrank brought up the issue of the inevitable pandemics in the near future, I'll toss another monkey wrench into the discussion. We are approaching the end of the era of antibiotics' ability to control bacterial infections; from what I am reading, we are already there with some strains of STD's, tuberculosis, MRSA, various staph and strep strains. I foresee our health care infrastructures being overwhelmed even in developed countries within the near future.

The only reason this is happening is because the drug outfits aren't developing new antibiotics because they can't get huge profits from them. At some point you'll see new classes of antibiotics developed. If the dug outfits won't do it either the Gov't will or pressure will be applied.

Originally Posted by tintin

from what i understand that is a result of the over use of antibiotics and focusing so hard on one strain of the disease. It allows other strains to take over. It's been noted that even if you get the chicken pox vaccine you are more likely to get a more severe case of shingles later in life, probably because your immune system has been weekend from not being exposed to the chicken pox (and re building your immune system to it) through out your life (since people aren't getting it anymore).

Once you get chickenpox the virus stays in your system forever. It just waits until later in life for the right conditions and comes out as shingles.

As I said in an earlier post, I had my shots when I was a kid. I remember clearly that I had them in school, I must have been about 5 - or maybe that was a different shot! Maybe that wasn't THE shots. I was too young and my parents are gone but what I do remember for sure. When a neighbourhood kid got chicken pox or the measles, me and some of my friends were sent over to play with him so we could get it.

I definitely remember the polio vaccination because it was on a sugar cube and we ate it.

I also remember getting a smallpox vaccination when I was about 10.

Steve

To quote a venerable Republican strategist, "Until the social media platforms do something about anti-vaxxers, their pernicious evil will continue to spread like measles through a population of uninoculated children."

Yo, Ivan, care to shut down this thread - and delete it? Like srsly?

Originally Posted by RobinK

To quote a venerable Republican strategist, "Until the social media platforms do something about anti-vaxxers, their pernicious evil will continue to spread like measles through a population of uninoculated children."

Yo, Ivan, care to shut down this thread - and delete it? Like srsly?

There are a variety of directions this thread can travel but it hasn't yet.

As long as it's a polite discussion.......

As long as people (and health professionals) keep noticing a connection between illness/death connected to vaccines it won't go away. Those who doubt should be open minded enough to at least listen to what health care workers are saying and then make their decision.

Originally Posted by tintin

As long as people (and health professionals) keep noticing a connection between illness/death connected to vaccines it won't go away.

I for one don't care what "people" "notice".
Damn, I don't even care what "people" freely infer from "statistics".

Correlation is not causality. Otherwise you could say that global warming is due to the diminution of the number of pirates through the years.

Originally Posted by tintin

Those who doubt should be open minded enough to at least listen to what health care workers are saying and then make their decision.

And I don't care what a nurse thinks. What she thinks she has experienced is nothing more than talking out of one's ass.

I care about what peer reviewed studies say, and what the state of the art knowledge is.
Because they are made through carefully crafted studies, by people who are trained in understanding what correlations are valid and what correlations are not, and, worse case scenario, if someone is wrong, then his/her/self work will be retracted in a near or far future.

It takes precaution, it takes abstraction, it takes reflexion and criticism. Not just feeling self rightous in a fight. Wanting the good of everyone is not the same thing as doing what's good for everyone.

Originally Posted by Aggelos

[...]global warming is due to the diminution of the number of pirates through the years.

AHA, I KNEW IT! This is very clearly the real cause...

Anti-vaxx is always interesting to me though. Like, the IDEA that Doctors can be wrong, or work against your best interest is really odd isn't it? At first glance I'd THINK, the poorer or less educated people would be more susceptible to this, but this doesn't seem to be true at all. Just from personal experience even, vaccination wasn't ever even a QUESTION when I was growing up. Whatever the doctor told you, you took their word as bible, MAYBE go to another doctor or correct them if you have some personal experience for simple stuff (e.g I always get really weird reactions from cold medicine, so I'd correct the doctor on that one sometimes). And mind you, my grandparents and parents believed some stuff that would be really really wrong, but "Doctors are all involved in a large conspiracy to kill all our babies" was never even a thought. Does anyone know if 'anti vaxx' existed as a thing in any relevant number (like the one odd fruitcake doesn't count) prior to the Andrew Wakefield thing? A quick looking around tells me that there may have always been some hesitancy around very religious people, (depending on the religion), which sort of makes sense..but not sure how big it was.

Well in the era of internet and google everybody has kind of become a physician. At least a diagnostician if that is even a term.
People read few things, extrapolate few others and now they feel they understand the complexity of diseases, the human body etc.
The one thing I always tell my residents is that - small amount of knowledge is actually dangerous. The more you learn the more you realize how complex things really are. Back to Socrates. I know that I know nothing.

What really pisses me off is that medicine as a field has made some remarkable progress over the last century. Vaccines, antibiotics, surgical procedures which people take for granted.
Years ago the Merck Manual of medicine for their 100th anniversary included the 1st edition, I think from the late 1800's. There you could read how illnesses were treated 100 something years ago. It's pretty eye opening. You feel it was 1000 years ago and not 100.

would you happen to have access to the warning/ingredient sheet that comes in the say, for example the hepatitis b shot given the infants? i would like to be proven wrong that i contains above the safe amount of aluminum.